a question about tori amos.

**Rob Helmerichs** · 02-07-2006, 09:04 AM

Originally Posted by mlpeters

I think those who call her a liar are splitting hairs about the whole sexual assaulted - vs. raped issue, like the former doesn't count or something. I believe Tori. I like Fiona Apple, but don't know what her problem with Tori is.

Yeah, the whole "MY sexual assault is worse than YOUR sexual assault" vibe seems kinda...unseemly.

**xyzzy** · 02-07-2006, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by Taki Soma

I don't like Apple or Amos' music, but personal feelings about their music aside, I would not be surprised if bothe the women have experienced sexual abuse on some level considering 1 in every 4 women are sexually abused sometime in their life.

How broadly is sexual abuse defined for that statistic?

**Ivan In Da Crypt** · 02-07-2006, 09:24 AM

are there "classes" of sexual assualt? if so id be interested to know what they were
because surely getting ass grabbed while casually walking along isnt the same as someone using physical force to restraining them etc.

but getting sexually assaulted sucks for girls if its such a casual thing (1 in 4 as you say)... because once i had my ass grabbed by a girl i didnt know in a club, and i felt like a piece of meat... gawdammit!

but im also glad that (if TV and movies havent lied to me), rapists and pedophiles get beaten up in jail by the murderers and robbers.

**Taki Soma** · 02-07-2006, 09:27 AM

Originally Posted by xyzzy

How broadly is sexual abuse defined for that statistic?

as I stated, sexual abuse of SOME sort.

could be anything, I guess. I did not conduct the statistics myself, I only leanred of it in school.

**xyzzy** · 02-07-2006, 09:31 AM

Originally Posted by Taki Soma

as I stated, sexual abuse of SOME sort.

could be anything, I guess. I did not conduct the statistics myself, I only leanred of it in school.

Like, would getting goosed be considered sexual abuse? Or getting your bra snapped? If it encompases stuff like that then that statistic seems reasonable. Maybe even low. But if only includes, say, a coerced sexual act, then it seems kind of high. But without some elaboration, that statistic is all but useless to me.

**Taki Soma** · 02-07-2006, 09:31 AM

Originally Posted by wittyfukivan

are there "classes" of sexual assualt? if so id be interested to know what they were
because surely getting ass grabbed while casually walking along isnt the same as someone using physical force to restraining them etc.

but getting sexually assaulted sucks for girls if its such a casual thing (1 in 4 as you say)... because once i had my ass grabbed by a girl i didnt know in a club, and i felt like a piece of meat... gawdammit!

but im also glad that (if TV and movies havent lied to me), rapists and pedophiles get beaten up in jail by the murderers and robbers.

you'd think that'll bring satisfaction, but really, the victim's life is damaged beyond justice against the assailant.

deep psychological, emotional damage is usually evident victims which require therapy, support of loved ones/friends/community, etc.

eitherway, most are permanently damaged on one degree or another. It is a sad thing.

**Taki Soma** · 02-07-2006, 09:33 AM

Originally Posted by xyzzy

Like, would getting goosed be considered sexual abuse? Or getting your bra snapped? If it encompases stuff like that then that statistic seems reasonable. Maybe even low. But if only includes, say, a coerced sexual act, then it seems kind of high. But without some elaboration, that statistic is all but useless to me.

from knowing other women and myself, it goes beyong aggressive flirting like you mentioned.

I know way too many women and some men who have been abused sexually.

and I don't know that many women, if that tells you anything.

**Ivan In Da Crypt** · 02-07-2006, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by Taki Soma

you'd think that'll bring satisfaction, but really, the victim's life is damaged beyond justice against the assailant.

deep psychological, emotional damage is usually evident victims which require therapy, support of loved ones/friends/community, etc.

eitherway, most are permanently damaged on one degree or another. It is a sad thing.

yes but i just like the honour among thieves thing
Satisfaction is also a debate in itself.... an eye for an eye?! i say nay... but then again im not the victim.

speaking of damage done... i know someone who has been raped, and i find it amazing how they've put all that behind them (even giving birth to the raped child and caring for her)....

**xyzzy** · 02-07-2006, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by Taki Soma

from knowing other women and myself, it goes beyong aggressive flirting like you mentioned.

I know way too many women and some men who have been abused sexually.

and I don't know that many women, if that tells you anything.

That's great anectodal evidence, but if you're going to toss out a statistic, I'd just like to know what it's based on.

**Taki Soma** · 02-07-2006, 09:38 AM

Originally Posted by xyzzy

That's great anectodal evidence, but if you're going to toss out a statistic, I'd just like to know what it's based on.

I don't know, it was during sex education in school many many years ago.

stats might be different now, too (for better or for worse)

we were all young, and were afraid to ask questions such as what we are asking now, like what degree is considered abuse in this stat, etc.