Immigrants should have to prove status when stopped, Branstad says

[Marcdachamp]

Well, that's sick, and it's an entirely different discussion and issue.

You and I both know that's not true.

[BriRedfern]

What I'm saying is that in the last 2 years, I've seen racism become more and more casual. People I never heard utter anything remotely racist now drop the "N" word like it's the '50's. Now, on top of that, you have this random xenophobia that you heard nothing of during the 8 years of the Bush administration.

Look, I'm not saying that Republicans are racist, or anything as general as that, but what I am saying is that NUTJOBS like this started becoming a little too vocal the second we got a president that just so happens to be black. And instead of smacking them down and pointing our fingers at them and saying "Bad!", we encourage it! We give them airtime, and press and consider their opinions like they should count. They shouldn't.

We're gonna make people show us their papers at a traffic stop? That's not partisan. That's insane. As you pointed out, that's an insanely easy way to have your identity stolen. And do you think it's going to happen to everyone? Fuck no. Who do you think is going to go through this extra BS? Probably not you or me.

First, thanks for explaining.

I haven't noticed any rise in racist rhetoric directly correlated to the new pres. Certainly people who know me don't say even casually racist things around me because of my particular situation.

I can see why people don't like these laws and I can see why people approve. As a man married to a Columbian woman that looks as white as any european ever, I can tell you that the law is flawed if it counts on visual queues to be enacted. You can't tell if someone is an illegal immigrant based on the way they look.

If a police officer has probable cause to suspect someone is an illegal alien than they should have some way of bringing that line of questioning to a reasonable conclusion - whether that should involve INS or not, I don't know. The correlary to this issue, making illegals afraid to involve the police in situations that they should be involved in, really needs to be addressed in any law like this that gets passed. People in this country (legal or illegal) CAN NOT be afraid to call 911 when the need arises.

[Marcdachamp]

People in this country (legal or illegal) CAN NOT be afraid to call 911 when the need arises.

Agreed 100%.

[Ben]

well it does say that they only have to prove citizenship when pulled over for a violation. So, it would the same for anyone who has to prove everything with documents no matter the color.

Now, if you are saying that they will pick and choose who to pull over because of this, well thats a different matter.

But, expect alot of states to start doing this because its become a States right thing since the Federal govt has ignored the issue for so long.

But again, what does my citizenship have to do with my traffic violation?

Tax fraud is a problem. How about next time you're pulled over, if you're married, you have to present your marriage license? Or maybe show your last five years worth of tax returns to prove you paid. If you didn't pay, present pay stubs showing you made less than the minimum required to file.

And I guess a counter argument is "When would citizenship be relevant to any crime?" I don't know. But this seems ridiculous.

Again, I could be stopped on foot by a police officer for committing some crime or just to be questioned and would often NOT be required to show ANY form of ID in many, many states. Not even if they arrested me! But now I'd have to have my birth certificate or passport on me?

[Cth]

I don't see how you could get a driver's license without a social security card.

There were three states that didn't require it for years.

Coincidentally, they had the highest concentration of illegals being brought in by buses

[Frozen Sooner]

But, expect alot of states to start doing this because its become a States right thing since the Federal govt has ignored the issue for so long.

Constitution fail.

[Treacle]

There were three states that didn't require it for years.

Coincidentally, they had the highest concentration of illegals being brought in by buses

Source?

[BriRedfern]

But again, what does my citizenship have to do with my traffic violation?

Tax fraud is a problem. How about next time you're pulled over, if you're married, you have to present your marriage license? Or maybe show your last five years worth of tax returns to prove you paid. If you didn't pay, present pay stubs showing you made less than the minimum required to file.

And I guess a counter argument is "When would citizenship be relevant to any crime?" I don't know. But this seems ridiculous.

Again, I could be stopped on foot by a police officer for committing some crime or just to be questioned and would often NOT be required to show ANY form of ID in many, many states. Not even if they arrested me! But now I'd have to have my birth certificate or passport on me?

If the person is stopped for some crime and has a bunch of materials with them that indicate they have been committing tax fraud (I don't what those materials would be) the police officer should look into that. Same with immigration. If a person's demeanor or particular situation in some way suggests that they are in the country illegally a police officer who sees this behavior should not have to ignore it.

I don't think there is an easy answer to this question that makes everyone happy. But there seldom is.

[Ben]

If the person is stopped for some crime and has a bunch of materials with them that indicate they have been committing tax fraud (I don't what those materials would be) the police officer should look into that. Same with immigration. If a person's demeanor or particular situation in some way suggests that they are in the country illegally a police officer who sees this behavior should not have to ignore it.

I don't think there is an easy answer to this question that makes everyone happy. But there seldom is.

That's true. And what you say makes sense. It just seems too vague.

[MIKE D]

That's true. And what you say makes sense. It just seems too vague.

Exactly. There's nothing I can think of that a person could do with their demeanor in front of a cop that could suggest illegal status beyond conjecture. I mean, what's the barometer? They don't speak English? What does that actually prove in the moment?