Why is DC so bad?

[Artie Pink]

DC has good titles, sure. But where are the great titles? Since Manhunter has gone away Booster Gold is the new little book that could. The Legion arc in Action Comics is high-end good.

But where is the break-out new talent? Or talent new to DC? Marvel gave Greg Pak the Incredible Hulk for 12 issues and he did a wonderful job. Brought a lot of people back to the series, myself included. I know DC's talent pool must have epic stories in them to tell, they must. Johns cannot be the only guy to want to reinvigorate and redefine a property (GL Rebirth and now Sinestro War/ Blackest Nihgt), but he might be the only one able to.

I know two things:
1) Those 52 issues of Countdown had better transition smoothly into Final Crisis. There had better be mention of Jimmy Olsen, Mary Marvel, Ray Palmer, all of that. If its not in there...well I don't even want to think about that.

2) After Final Crisis, creators need to be able to tell their stories. We had the lead up to Infinite Crisis (good stuff, but still leading towards a company event), we had One Year Later (in my opinion a massive creative opportunity was lost here), and now we are Counting Down to the Final Crisis. Which is fine, I understand. I really do. But after Final Crisis, DC needs to refocus all energies on the characters and not event umbrella. Justice League should be DC's flagship ongoing at all times, but I'm not sure if it is. If it is, I'm not sure that its warranted.

I eagerly look forward to DC utilizing the great and iconic characters they have. They have (had?) a rich history and legacy that is pretty much unique to DC Comics alone and its time to reinvest in the properties. And the creators who look after them.

Creator-wise, I'd say DC is on top of it, and has ALL of your creator concerns covered.

I'd say Grant Morrison on Batman and Superman are a coup, though he's not "new talent".

Bringing Dini in to do Batman comics after doing the best ever version of the character in the animated series was something of a stroke of obvious genius.

Johns left Teen Titans, but he's making magic on Action Comics, now that the art's been settled.

Dodson drawing Wonder Woman is a perfect match.

Gary Frank finally has the A-list title he deserves.

Tony Daniel was plucked from obscurity and handed one of the top characters in comics.

Who's this Dale Eaglesham guy who's drawing the hell out of JSA?

The only thing better than Guedes on Supergirl will be Guedes on Superman.

Who was Ivan Reis before Green Lantern?

Cliff Chiang on Green Arrow is so good that I buy it even though Judd Winnick writes it.

Where'd they find this maniac who's drawing Shooter's Legion?


Now all they have to do is let these creators CREATE, and not micro-manage or editorially mandate their art. And by all means, sweep that crappy continuity - even recent crappy Countdown Jimmy/Mary continuity - under the rug and never mention it again.

[Foolish Mortal]

I gave up on Countdown months ago. Its too much like Infinite Crisis. (Which I hated) You have too many characters in too many storylines that seem disjointed and have no real connection, and the helter-skelter way they switch back and forth is confusing.

I've decided to just wait for Final Crisis.

[The Human Target]

Because they love the Silvery Age crap of yesteryear?

Because they have become obsessed with crossovers?

Because they love dragging up minor plot points from 40 years ago without explanation?

Because they have a strong editorial mandate on writing and art style, so if you don't like one book their is a very good chance you won't like any?

Because you hate freedom?

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Everyone brings Action Comics and Wonder Woman to the forefront in this discussion, but both have their problems.

Someone please tell what is going on with the LoSH. There are now three or four versions running around. Did Superman go to the future when he was a kid or not?

Wonder Woman has only been good to me once. Rucka's run was really good. However, that has been swept aside due Infinite Crisis.

Batman is supposedly good, and I tried the first few issues when Morrisson took over, but there was no reason to mess with it when Winnick was writing it.

I was wrong for not including JSA.

Who knows what's going on with the Legion. But the Legion in Action Comics is as close to what I recognize as anything so I'm with that one. The good thing about that Action arc is that it is a great introduction for new people. As much as I really hate to say it, as far as the Legion goes you need to know names, powers, and what planet they come from. You can get characterization elsewhere. But now a lot of new people know the basics and that'll have to be good enough for me.

I caught up on the new Gail Simone Wonder Woman issues to have come out and they're good comics. And kind of fun, yet at times deadly serious. I've never been a Wonder Woman fan as far as the comics. Either too much mythology, uncertainty about who she is and what her purpose is, or some combination of those. Rucka's Wonder Woman resonated with me because he had the right mixtures of mythology, super hero, and political ambassador to "man's world." For the first time, I understood Wonder Woman. I wonder if Gail has a "Sinestro War" type of story for Wonder Woman in store for us. I think Amazons Attack was supposed to be the "Sinestro War" for that corner of the DCU, but we won't discuss that.

I want the individual creators to be able to tell an exciting but logical story within their titles that will get people to say "hey what's going on here?"

[AAlgar]

So, just so I have this right... You guys want realistic, down-to-earth comics... that are completely off-the-wall and swarming with magic robots?

[Foolish Mortal]

Everyone brings Action Comics and Wonder Woman to the forefront in this discussion, but both have their problems.

Someone please tell what is going on with the LoSH. There are now three or four versions running around. Did Superman go to the future when he was a kid or not?

Wonder Woman has only been good to me once. Rucka's run was really good. However, that has been swept aside due Infinite Crisis.

Batman is supposedly good, and I tried the first few issues when Morrisson took over, but there was no reason to mess with it when Winnick was writing it.

I was wrong for not including JSA.

Yes, Superman went into the future (as an adult) and had adventures with a Legion of Super-Heroes that appear to be based on the 60's/70's version.

Mark Waid's Legion appears to be set on a different Earth.

[greg donovan]

So, just so I have this right... You guys want realistic, down-to-earth comics... that are completely off-the-wall and swarming with magic robots?

yep.

is that so hard for a company to make?

i also would like to have ice cream that isnt too cold, yet still not melted.

and if you could find a way for my job to keep paying me while i sit on my couch reading my fantastically realistically unbelievable down to earth comics while eating my warm frozen ice cream it would be greatly appreciated.

[GrandeMaestro Fünke]

Everyone brings Action Comics and Wonder Woman to the forefront in this discussion, but both have their problems.

Someone please tell what is going on with the LoSH. There are now three or four versions running around. Did Superman go to the future when he was a kid or not?

Wonder Woman has only been good to me once. Rucka's run was really good. However, that has been swept aside due Infinite Crisis.

Batman is supposedly good, and I tried the first few issues when Morrisson took over, but there was no reason to mess with it when Winnick was writing it.

I was wrong for not including JSA.

Raphel pretty much covered this, but Action Comics has been fine since Johns went solo on the title and Gary Frank came on. Wonder Woman's been really since Gail Simone.

It's become pretty clear the Legion will have a big role in Final Crisis. There's only two versions that I'm aware of. The classic one that went to the present in JLA and is currently appearing in Action Comics, and then there's the new one that Waid created. Shooter's done a decent job so far handeling them.

Batman's okay. The Ra crossover was kind of a mess, but Dini's Detective has been really good. Also Winnick probably left because when OYL started he was working on his cartoon, and had less time to write comics. His Green Arrow/Black Canary has been pretty fun.

The only really huge mess at DC right now is Countdown, and I haven't read it since month 2, and it hasn't affected my enjoyment of the DC Universe. I don't need to know anything about it to understand all the other DC books.

I'm going to re-read Blue Beetle. That series gets constant love and attention online. Subscriptions are low for it at the shop, but a few of the people getting it are very vocal about it. I read the first couple and a few random ones here and there, but I'm now going to re-read all of them and report back when I'm done.

It gets pretty good once Giffen leaves. I think you'll like it a lot.

[Sy-Klone]

YPJ has pretty much summed up the points I'd make.

At the moment, DC has an incredible stable of talented writers: Morrison, Johns, Simone, Busiek, Dini, Rucka. These folks can write and tell interesting, compelling stories.

DC needs to stand back and let these people create. Let them take risks. Let them do things you wouldn't expect. They'll bring the audience back. They'll boost sales. But you need to let them work their magic instead of micromanaging them or the line or the characters or the continuity.

[Artie Pink]

Batman is supposedly good, and I tried the first few issues when Morrisson took over, but there was no reason to mess with it when Winnick was writing it.

I'd tackle this statement, but I don't want to be patronizing towards you.



("patronizing" means "talk down to you in a condescending manner")