She-Hulk #17 Thoughts and Reactions *SPOILERS*

[Dermie]

***WARNING!!!! This post contains SPOILERS for SHE-HULK #17!!!! If you do not wish to be spoiled, please do not read any further!!!! You have been warned!!!!


World Without A Hulk: Part 3!

Our dear Stuplicate is clearly not endearing himself to Chas and Lewis, but although they've noticed that "Stu" has changed, they don't seem to be suspicious at all yet.
Although I can generally do without a lot of the meta-humour talking about comics IN the comics, I *did* get a chuckle out of Chas and Lewis' debate about the Helicarrier splash pages--the over-use of them in recent years has become a pet peeve of mine too.

Rick Jones was the one who did Jen's "Hulkbusters" soundtrack remix--nice continuity touch there Dan.

Looks like the Hulkbuster unit has been quite busy lately--too bad we didn't get to see more of the U-Foes fight; those guys are fun. Apparently Agent Cheesecake got to use her other special skills in that fight--it looks like she seduced Vector into submission! *L*

Gaffer should keep his snide comments about Shulkie's Helicarrier experiences to himself--in case he's forgotten, the first time she was there she was also falsely arrested, subjected to strip searches and experiments, etc. If *anyone* has a reason to be holding a grudge here, its Jen!

Tony Stark finally makes his non-shadowy debut as SHIELD's new director (with a cute comment about the bad lighting, acknowledging his shadowy appearances last issue).

Was it just me, or did Clay seem WAY too interested in having Tony debrief him?? Was he just having a blond moment, and not picking up on the romantic setting Tony had set up for the "debriefing", or what? (or maybe Clay is just angling to get a promotion by any means necessary )

So...She-Hulk and Tony Stark. Well, it is definately a step up from trying to get into Wolverine's pants last issue. Its funny, I never would have thought of pairing these two--but given that Tony is one of the Avengers biggest playboys and Shulkie is one of their biggest playgirls, it almost seems like it was inevitable. It appears that Tony was the one who made the first move...so I wonder what prompted him to pursue her now? I wonder if this fling will extend into next issue, or if it will be a one-issue stand, like Clay was in #15? (maybe Clay will finally get that 'debriefing' he wants, and he, Shulkie and Tony can have a threesome )
The double standard of Tony's rep vs Shulkie's rep gets brought up, but we never get to hear what Tony's opinion on the subject was.

Back at the law firm, Mr Zix has survived his punishment by his mysterious masters...although he has not yet fully put all his pieces back together.

Mallory's determined to win back the respect of her supervillain clients after the tabloids have made a laughing stock of her and her affair with Awesome Andy. She and Two-Gun burst into The Bar With No Name to confront the villains. If nothing else, you've got to give Mallory credit for guts!
And speaking of guts, Matt decides to take on the entire room full of super-powered bad guys due to their mocking of Mal. Poor Matt comes out of the brawl a bit worse for wear...but he's still in one piece, so that's impressive.
Dan also manages to sneak in a reference to the Punisher's recent assault on the bar, and explain how all the villains survived their apparent deaths in that issue)

Zzzax ends up escaping his containment unit, and running amok aboard the Helicarrier, turning the defense systems loose against Tony and the agents, and turning all the Nick Fury LMDs against Shulkie!
He even manages to take control of Agent Cheesecake and turn her against Clay and Crimson!

Project Achilles is apparently a success--they've studied the physiology of the captured Hulk foes and have developed a weapon to sedate them...just in the nick of time, since Zzzax set them all loose again.

Shulkie manages to recapture Zzzax in a modified stasis box, but the damage has been done...the Nick Fury LMDs have been replaying all their old dialogue, and one of them lets slip a conversation with Bruce Banner from when Tony and the others were plotting to launch the Hulk into space! Obviously Jen doesn't have all the pieces of the puzzle yet--but this clue is gonna point her in the right direction, and then Tony Stark is gonna be in deeeeep trouble!

Thanks Dan, for another fun issue! I'm looking forward to seeing the big conclusion next issue!

[Miss Kitty Fantastico]

Interesting issue, full of story as always. At first glance the Stu page seemed a little gratuitous, but then it occurred to me that, in most books, the first page of a story like this probably would have been a splash of the carrier, to establish the size of the thing in preparation for the chaos on board later on - so that was a neat way of achieving that and poking fun at it at the same time. And in a similar vein, Tony showing up complaining about the shadow was a cute jab at his appearances up 'til now - not that I think most of us hadn't guessed it was him, even before Civil War wrapped up.

There was some weird ups and downs with the art this issue - some scenes I felt were really top notch, not just in terms of facial expressions which Burchett does well every month, but also proportions and depth, and making Shulkie look pretty hot in her 'unmentionables', plus Cheesecake kicking ass and looking glorious doing so. But then there were some panels that really looked flat, and had weird proportions (like Agent Cake in the last panel - was her head supposed to have been damaged in the fighting, or what? And Shulkie's facial features, expressive though they are, still tend to wander over her head a bit). I don't want to be one of those people who jumps in demanding an artist change, but, well... surely if Burchett can do the great job he does on the good pages, he can fix the fairly obviously lapses on the others?

I thought how Dan had Jen get her first real clue to Bruce's disappearance was very clever - I guessed it might be something like that as soon as the Furybots started shooting off random phrases (didn't really need Tony to explain what was going on, but best for it to be on the record I guess), but even so it was a very smart way to use the available resources to have She-Hulk find out what she needed to know, without having the information just be lying around waiting for her to find.

As for She-Hulk and Tony 'debriefing'... well, at least she'll know exactly where to kick next issue

[Dermie]

Interesting issue, full of story as always. At first glance the Stu page seemed a little gratuitous, but then it occurred to me that, in most books, the first page of a story like this probably would have been a splash of the carrier, to establish the size of the thing in preparation for the chaos on board later on - so that was a neat way of achieving that and poking fun at it at the same time.

Also, while the scene appears pointless on the surface it is there to remind readers about Stu being replaced by the Stuplicate--since that subplot is still in-progress, they need to bring it up every so often to keep it alive for the readers.

[Miss Kitty Fantastico]

Also, while the scene appears pointless on the surface it is there to remind readers about Stu being replaced by the Stuplicate

True, but there was another such scene just last issue, essentially the same scene - the Stuplicate not caring at all about the geeks' arguments. I think without the meta-relevance to this issue's story that page (a whole page, mind) would have seemed redundant. As it is of course, not the case.

[Dingo]

True, but there was another such scene just last issue, essentially the same scene - the Stuplicate not caring at all about the geeks' arguments. I think without the meta-relevance to this issue's story that page (a whole page, mind) would have seemed redundant. As it is of course, not the case.

meta-relevance is nice, but I think Dan just remembers that some people may be picking this up as their first She-hulk comic. Nice to re-cover ground for them.

[Edward J. Cunningham]

[QUOTE=Dermie;2949498]***WARNING!!!! This post contains SPOILERS for SHE-HULK #17!!!! If you do not wish to be spoiled, please do not read any further!!!! You have been warned!!!!


World Without A Hulk: Part 3!

Our dear Stuplicate is clearly not endearing himself to Chas and Lewis, but although they've noticed that "Stu" has changed, they don't seem to be suspicious at all yet.
Although I can generally do without a lot of the meta-humour talking about comics IN the comics, I *did* get a chuckle out of Chas and Lewis' debate about the Helicarrier splash pages--the over-use of them in recent years has become a pet peeve of mine too.

Rick Jones was the one who did Jen's "Hulkbusters" soundtrack remix--nice continuity touch there Dan.

Looks like the Hulkbuster unit has been quite busy lately--too bad we didn't get to see more of the U-Foes fight; those guys are fun. Apparently Agent Cheesecake got to use her other special skills in that fight--it looks like she seduced Vector into submission! *L*

Gaffer should keep his snide comments about Shulkie's Helicarrier experiences to himself--in case he's forgotten, the first time she was there she was also falsely arrested, subjected to strip searches and experiments, etc. If *anyone* has a reason to be holding a grudge here, its Jen!

Tony Stark finally makes his non-shadowy debut as SHIELD's new director (with a cute comment about the bad lighting, acknowledging his shadowy appearances last issue).

Was it just me, or did Clay seem WAY too interested in having Tony debrief him?? Was he just having a blond moment, and not picking up on the romantic setting Tony had set up for the "debriefing", or what? (or maybe Clay is just angling to get a promotion by any means necessary )[/URL]

I didn't realize this until I read it a second time, but Dan is clearly making a pun on the word "debrief". The technical definition means to give someone the latest information about a situation, but in this case Stark was planning to LITERALLY "de-brief" Jennifer, as in "remove her briefs (underwear)."

I suspect that Clay realized what Stark was planning on doing, and that's why he was vigorously objecting. But you're right---if Clay isn't too careful he might just get his wish and get defriefed himself.

"You wanted to see me, Director Stark?"
"Now let's you just drop them pants..."

So...She-Hulk and Tony Stark. Well, it is definately a step up from trying to get into Wolverine's pants last issue. Its funny, I never would have thought of pairing these two--but given that Tony is one of the Avengers biggest playboys and Shulkie is one of their biggest playgirls, it almost seems like it was inevitable. It appears that Tony was the one who made the first move...so I wonder what prompted him to pursue her now? I wonder if this fling will extend into next issue, or if it will be a one-issue stand, like Clay was in #15? (maybe Clay will finally get that 'debriefing' he wants, and he, Shulkie and Tony can have a threesome )

Although Jennifer has always been free and open about her sex life since becoming the She-Hulk, sleeping with her boss seems a bit out of character---except that Dan has set this up the past few issues. She hits on Quartermain and goes to bed with him. Privately, she admits this is something Jen wouldn't have done. (Indeed, when Dan Slott wrote Jennifer into that Spidey/Torch story, he had her decline Johnny's romantic offers once he became her teammate, since she did not feel comfortable about it.) Then she hits on Wolverine, who turns her down flat. Would anybody think at this point that if Stark put the moves on her she would say, "no"?

I think this is going to set up Jennifer becoming REALLY angry at Tony for his betrayal of her. I also think this is going to lead up to She-Hulk voluntarily changing back to Jen Walters to "ground herself" once more. Although it is possible that Crimson might change her back to Jen to save his boss' hide, the fact that we see Jen Walters in human form on an upcoming issue of She-Hulk suggests that she has given up being green 24/7. (Although we should not accept the covers as gospel truth. In issue #17, a Nick Fury LMD does NOT push Jen out of the Helicarrier with one of their hovercars while she is wearing a SHIELD uniform.)

The double standard of Tony's rep vs Shulkie's rep gets brought up, but we never get to hear what Tony's opinion on the subject was.

Back at the law firm, Mr Zix has survived his punishment by his mysterious masters...although he has not yet fully put all his pieces back together.

Mallory's determined to win back the respect of her supervillain clients after the tabloids have made a laughing stock of her and her affair with Awesome Andy. She and Two-Gun burst into The Bar With No Name to confront the villains. If nothing else, you've got to give Mallory credit for guts!
And speaking of guts, Matt decides to take on the entire room full of super-powered bad guys due to their mocking of Mal. Poor Matt comes out of the brawl a bit worse for wear...but he's still in one piece, so that's impressive.

Dan also manages to sneak in a reference to the Punisher's recent assault on the bar, and explain how all the villains survived their apparent deaths in that issue)

I can't believe that I overlooked the obvious when trying to think of the reasons why the bad guys were not calling on Mallory---that she lost credibility with them through her love affair with Awesome Andy. The fact that Matt does NOT try to talk her out of defending bad guys shows that he is more of a match for her than Andy was. I'm sure though that he probably wishes she didn't go to the Bar With No Name. Wyatt probably felt the same way though when Jen went to visit The Naked Truth publisher Stan Lee in human form.

Zzzax ends up escaping his containment unit, and running amok aboard the Helicarrier, turning the defense systems loose against Tony and the agents, and turning all the Nick Fury LMDs against Shulkie!
He even manages to take control of Agent Cheesecake and turn her against Clay and Crimson!

Project Achilles is apparently a success--they've studied the physiology of the captured Hulk foes and have developed a weapon to sedate them...just in the nick of time, since Zzzax set them all loose again.

Shulkie manages to recapture Zzzax in a modified stasis box, but the damage has been done...the Nick Fury LMDs have been replaying all their old dialogue, and one of them lets slip a conversation with Bruce Banner from when Tony and the others were plotting to launch the Hulk into space! Obviously Jen doesn't have all the pieces of the puzzle yet--but this clue is gonna point her in the right direction, and then Tony Stark is gonna be in deeeeep trouble!

Thanks Dan, for another fun issue! I'm looking forward to seeing the big conclusion next issue!

Too bad we're going to have to wait an extra week. Hope issue #18 does not get delayed further since it is coming out the SAME week now that Incredible Hulk #106 is scheduled, and that issue takes place immediately AFTER #18. Which means if there is another delay, the Hulk issue may reveal spoilers for She-Hulk...

[Dermie]

I suspect that Clay realized what Stark was planning on doing, and that's why he was vigorously objecting.

I dunno--he seemed pretty clueless about it, insisting "if anyone gets debriefed here, it should be me!" Either he was really oblivious to Tony's intentions, or he was falling victim to Tony's infamous charm and appeal.

But you're right---if Clay isn't too careful he might just get his wish and get defriefed himself.

"You wanted to see me, Director Stark?"
"Now let's you just drop them pants..."

Tony Stark has done a lot of things lately that have shocked readers--but that would probably take the cake!

Although Jennifer has always been free and open about her sex life since becoming the She-Hulk, sleeping with her boss seems a bit out of character

Well, when she first started working for Blake Tower in the D.A.'s office (back when he still had his hair and his looks) she was interested in him despite him being her boss.

And to be fair, Jen hasn't had a lot of bosses over the years who were really options for romance or sex. Blake and Reed were both married. Holden Holliway is too old for her. Jen was already involved when she met Zix (and he creeped her out anyway). Wasp and Pulsar are women, and are not bisexual (as far as we know). I could see her being interested in sleeping with Captain America...but that wouldn be out of character for him.

(Indeed, when Dan Slott wrote Jennifer into that Spidey/Torch story, he had her decline Johnny's romantic offers once he became her teammate, since she did not feel comfortable about it.)

That may have been more about the familial nature of the FF team. Being teammates didn't stop her from sleeping with Starfox, lusting after Hercules, kissing Hawkeye, etc.

I think this is going to set up Jennifer becoming REALLY angry at Tony for his betrayal of her.

Absolutely. There is now an even more personal element to the betrayal.

(Although we should not accept the covers as gospel truth. In issue #17, a Nick Fury LMD does NOT push Jen out of the Helicarrier with one of their hovercars while she is wearing a SHIELD uniform.)

Yeah, the covers are often more symbolic than literal.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

I LOVED the LMD scene!

Dan, can you give us a key to where the various dialogues are from? I could only identify two or three, but that whole thing was the best thing ever for those who knew what they were looking at.

[Colin Solan]

I think the irony of the upcoming issues is that She-Hulk has been helping SHIELD prepare to take herself down.

Yeah, she's got issues.

[Edward J. Cunningham]

I think the irony of the upcoming issues is that She-Hulk has been helping SHIELD prepare to take herself down.

Yeah, she's got issues.

Herself down? Unless She-Hulk were to become as powerful as she briefly did during the Avengers: Disassembled arc, I don't think all those Hulk villains would be necessary to take her out. I'm interested to see how the next issue wraps up because on one hand Jennifer will not---as much as she (and many readers) want to---break every bone in Tony Stark's body. Also, it seems clear that Jen will not end up as a fugitive unregistered superheroine since we see Jen on the cover (as a lawyer) in the next issue. And we know that Hulk #106 opens with Jen Walters in human form. Did she change voluntarily, or is this the result of a spell cast by Crimson?