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Ben
11-27-2006, 06:27 AM
I was watching religious programming this weekend, and there were lots of specials about the Da Vinci code airing again because it's coming out on DVD. They're going to great lengths to try and make people understand that the "facts" presented by Dan Brown about Jesus are not actually factual and that the only real facts are found in the Bible. (Personally, I think you'd have to be an idiot to get Jesus information from a novel, but it seems that lots of people are idiots) They're all scrambing! The see lots of Christians getting confused and turned away from the "true" message of Jesus and Christianity.

I find it hilarious because it's such a great parallel to what the Christians put scientists through! The Christians basically write their Da Vinci Codes and scientists have to scrambe to make sure people understand what's fact (evolution) and what's fiction (dinosaur and human footprints found together). So it's fun to see them get a taste of their own medicine.

That is all.

Basketball Jesus
11-27-2006, 06:29 AM
Not to mention it probably finally let John Grisham and Steven King let out some of the writing snobbery that had been building up in them.

DAVE
11-27-2006, 06:31 AM
Read OUR make believe stories about Jesus, not Dan Brown's!
I think Bible's should Alan Moore's "Whatever Happened to the Man of Steel?" disclaimer on the first page.

jason hissong
11-27-2006, 06:33 AM
But it's still a terrible book.

Ben
11-27-2006, 06:36 AM
But it's still a terrible book.And someone (any geneticists here?) needs to tell me how you can link someone to Jesus after so many generations have passed.

DAVE
11-27-2006, 06:39 AM
And someone (any geneticists here?) needs to tell me how you can link someone to Jesus after so many generations have passed.

I'm no geneticsit, but I'd think you couldn't unless you had some Jesus DNA, which we don't have. Because he rose fro mthe dead and flew to heaven, duh! The only way we'd have his DNA is if we extracted it with a kryptonite scalpel or something.

ClintP
11-27-2006, 06:40 AM
My wife and I liked it and we are Catholic. However, we can read and enjoy fiction regardless of the theme.

I prefer A&D over it though.

ClintP
11-27-2006, 06:41 AM
I don't understand why so many ppl get so pissed off at that book. I imagine it was because it was so popular. If it never was a success, no one would give two shits about it.

Ben
11-27-2006, 06:42 AM
I'm no geneticsit, but I'd think you couldn't unless you had some Jesus DNA, which we don't have. Because he rose fro mthe dead and flew to heaven, duh! The only way we'd have his DNA is if we extracted it with a kryptonite scalpel or something.I think they had Jesus' DNA. But probably... say... 100 generations have passed since Jesus. I think the way they determine relatedness genetically is to see how many of certain alleles are in common between the two. But after 100 generations, you're just as likely to have the same number of alleles in common with your ancestor Jesus as will with any other person alive at the time.

Ben
11-27-2006, 06:44 AM
I don't understand why so many ppl get so pissed off at that book. I imagine it was because it was so popular. If it never was a success, no one would give two shits about it.There was an excellent book that came out before 2000 that was about a female Jesus (Jesa) appearing in Israel at midnight Dec. 31, 1999. It went into a lot of Vatican conspiracies and stuff. I forget the name... it was a great book, though. I don't know why it wasn't more popular. I never heard a peep out of the church about it. Probably a smart move. Any protest would've put it on people's radar.

DAVE
11-27-2006, 06:45 AM
I think they had Jesus' DNA. But probably... say... 100 generations have passed since Jesus. I think the way they determine relatedness genetically is to see how many of certain alleles are in common between the two. But after 100 generations, you're just as likely to have the same number of alleles in common with your ancestor Jesus as will with any other person alive at the time.

That's true. I remember seeing article an few monthes ago about just that.

Jerome Gibbons
11-27-2006, 06:49 AM
I don't understand why so many ppl get so pissed off at that book. I imagine it was because it was so popular. If it never was a success, no one would give two shits about it.

It always annoys people when tripe makes it big. :)

ClintP
11-27-2006, 06:49 AM
There was an excellent book that came out before 2000 that was about a female Jesus (Jesa) appearing in Israel at midnight Dec. 31, 1999. It went into a lot of Vatican conspiracies and stuff. I forget the name... it was a great book, though. I don't know why it wasn't more popular. I never heard a peep out of the church about it. Probably a smart move. Any protest would've put it on people's radar.
Sounds interesting. Like I said, I enjoy good reads regardless of the theme. Most people just like to get pissed off and make big deals about stuff I guess. The more you raise hell about something, the more you are going to attract people to read it like you said.

For the longest time, I refused to read it solely on how popular it was. It had nothing to do with beliefs and such. Kinda like how people avoid the comics that are so highly hyped. I read Digital Fortress at a friend's request and liked it alot. Out of all of Dan Brown's books, I enjoyed Deception Point the most. I read that book in a day because it was so damn good. Every fucking chapter left me wanting more. After I read that one, I read Angels and Demons and then finally read DaVinci Code.

All are good reads.

eroz
11-27-2006, 06:50 AM
It always annoys people when tripe makes it big. :)

But how can people not like tripe (Menudo)? I love that! :D

eroz
11-27-2006, 06:51 AM
There was an excellent book that came out before 2000 that was about a female Jesus (Jesa) appearing in Israel at midnight Dec. 31, 1999. It went into a lot of Vatican conspiracies and stuff. I forget the name... it was a great book, though. I don't know why it wasn't more popular. I never heard a peep out of the church about it. Probably a smart move. Any protest would've put it on people's radar.

Figure out the title of that book. It actually sounds pretty interesting.

Len Ford
11-27-2006, 06:54 AM
And someone (any geneticists here?) needs to tell me how you can link someone to Jesus after so many generations have passed.

http://genealogy.about.com/cs/geneticgenealogy/a/dna_tests.htm

There was a really interesting show on the History Channel last night about the Da Vinci Code. Did anyone else see it? I think they were basically using different accounts of history to tell the history of the Grail from the perspectives presented in the movie (Grail = cup, Grail = person).

DAVE
11-27-2006, 06:54 AM
My wife and I liked it and we are Catholic. However, we can read and enjoy fiction regardless of the theme.

I prefer A&D over it though.

Yeah that's because of you and your wife are rasonable people. I would guess people of faith who have that much trouble with fiction based on their faithes, don't actually have that much faith, if it could be challenged so easily.

Ben
11-27-2006, 06:58 AM
http://genealogy.about.com/cs/geneticgenealogy/a/dna_tests.htm


Oh, I guess they could do a mitochondrial DNA test and link her to Mary... unless she isn't part of an unbroken matriline.

ClintP
11-27-2006, 06:59 AM
Yeah that's because of you and your wife are rasonable people. I would guess people of faith who have that much trouble with fiction based on their faithes, don't actually have that much faith, if it could be challenged so easily.
Yeah, that is exacly our opinion on that. We are also of the notion that we could care less what other people believe. If thousands of people stopped believing because of a work of fiction, then good for them. It still doesn't affect us. :) I like the arguement that Dan Brown is trying to present it as fact, when it is clearly marked fiction at the bookstore/library. :)

Anyone knows that to tell a good story, you have to use real events and things that people are familiar with and add a little twist to it. If the reader can't relate to it at all, chances are there will be no readers...

Magnum V.I.
11-27-2006, 06:59 AM
My wife and I liked it and we are Catholic. However, we can read and enjoy fiction regardless of the theme.

I prefer A&D over it though.

Angels and Demons was 100 times better. The conspiracy was cool and the little history notes were awesome (About Peter being the Corner Stone of the Church)

But after I read deception Point I realize that Dan Brown uses the same plot formula over and over and his books are no longer fun to read. However I will read The Solomon Key.

Jerome Gibbons
11-27-2006, 07:01 AM
Angels and Demons was 100 times better. The conspiracy was cool and the little history notes were awesome (About Peter being the Corner Stone of the Church)

But after I read deception Point I realize that Dan Brown uses the same plot formula over and over and his books are no longer fun to read. However I will read The Solomon Key.

Is that the one where

Some guy finds scientific proof that God exists?

ClintP
11-27-2006, 07:03 AM
Is that the one where

Some guy finds scientific proof that God exists?

yes

ClintP
11-27-2006, 07:05 AM
Angels and Demons was 100 times better. The conspiracy was cool and the little history notes were awesome (About Peter being the Corner Stone of the Church)

But after I read deception Point I realize that Dan Brown uses the same plot formula over and over and his books are no longer fun to read. However I will read The Solomon Key.

Yes, he does use the same device, but I like it. It is also why I love James Patterson's books and Dean Koontz. I can read any of their books, but they are all very similar.

Magnum V.I.
11-27-2006, 07:06 AM
Yes, he does use the same device, but I like it. It is also why I love James Patterson's books and Dean Koontz. I can read any of their books, but they are all very similar.

Yeah But Dean Koontz has a different plot every 3 book. But it always has that freaky alien, science fiction horror element to it.


Oh and Brother Odd comes out Tommorrow!

Jerome Gibbons
11-27-2006, 07:09 AM
yes

That's interesting. I think I'll watch that Futurama episode instead, though. :)

Magnum V.I.
11-27-2006, 07:10 AM
That's interesting. I think I'll watch that Futurama episode instead, though. :)

When you do things right, People wont be sure you've done anything at all. -God

Ben
11-27-2006, 08:14 AM
When you do things right, People wont be sure you've done anything at all. -GodHow convenient...

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 08:21 AM
What I hate about people is that they think Dan Brown used recently found historical evidence for his fictional novel. What a bunch of chumps!

Ben
11-27-2006, 08:27 AM
What I hate about people is that they think Dan Brown used recently found historical evidence for his fictional novel. What a bunch of chumps!I don't understand anyone taking anything said in a novel at face value. Reminds me of Jurassic Park where people came away from it thinking that we really do know there were poison-spitting dinosaurs. If you take your curiosity and do some learnin', you'll find out that, while we don't know they spit poison, it wasn't a random choice by Crichton. There actually is a little gap in the jaw bone of that group (it's its defining characteristic). In modern "spitters," you see that same gap, so paleontologists have speculated they may have had poison glands there. It gets cooler when you take the curiosity the novel created and go learn something real.

I have no problem with Dan Brown taking a few facts and conspiracy theories and turning it into an exciting story. It's the readers that just assume it's all 100% true that are lame.

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 08:30 AM
I have no problem with Dan Brown taking a few facts and conspiracy theories and turning it into an exciting story. It's the readers that just assume it's all 100% true that are lame.
Amen, brother!

I still want to read the book sometime. The movie was trash but I enjoyed watching it with my best friend. We had a good laugh at the ridiculousness of it all.

WillieLee
11-27-2006, 08:40 AM
When you do things right, People wont be sure you've done anything at all. -God

Try using that one at your job.

Ben
11-27-2006, 08:52 AM
Try using that one at your job.It's true for comic book letterers. And movie directors even.

JamesV
11-27-2006, 10:12 AM
It's true for comic book letterers. And movie directors even.

And truck drivers...

"Oh look! The store is fully stocked again!"

glk
11-27-2006, 10:15 AM
I just saw this on DVD and thought it was a lot of fun. I enjoyed the book and thought the movie was a solid adaptation. I don't care what the church thinks of it, it's entertainment. I don't see movies for history lessons.

jason hissong
11-27-2006, 10:48 AM
But it's still a terrible book.

Damian696
11-27-2006, 01:00 PM
Figure out the title of that book. It actually sounds pretty interesting.

http://ec2.images-amazon.com/images/P/0446605980.01._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-dp-500-arrow,TopRight,45,-64_AA240_SH20_OU01_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

Damian696
11-27-2006, 01:04 PM
I think they had Jesus' DNA. But probably... say... 100 generations have passed since Jesus. I think the way they determine relatedness genetically is to see how many of certain alleles are in common between the two. But after 100 generations, you're just as likely to have the same number of alleles in common with your ancestor Jesus as will with any other person alive at the time.

Hey, it's Jesus DNA. Feeble puny humans DNA stands no chance against it. :D

Vonn Hennigar
11-27-2006, 01:13 PM
I watched it last night and it was...Okay.

The entire opening sequence though with a fucking Gut-shot man being able to crawl around, leaving clues in invisible ink and then stripping down so he could die in The Vitruvian Man pose was by far THE dumbest thing i've seen in a long long time.

Ben
11-27-2006, 01:15 PM
Hey, it's Jesus DNA. Feeble puny humans DNA stands no chance against it. :DActually, if I remember correctly, in the movie (I didn't read the book), they test her against MARY'S DNA. Mary... the prostitute!!! How is that proof that she's related to Jesus? Am I wrong? It's been a while since I saw the movie.

Damian696
11-27-2006, 01:26 PM
Actually, if I remember correctly, in the movie (I didn't read the book), they test her against MARY'S DNA. Mary... the prostitute!!! How is that proof that she's related to Jesus? Am I wrong? It's been a while since I saw the movie.

I haven't seen the movie or read the book, so I can't really add anything useful ... :Oops:

and I think Jesus went to Japan and is buried there. :scared:

ClintP
11-27-2006, 01:35 PM
And truck drivers...

"Oh look! The store is fully stocked again!"
I can agree with that. People love to hate on truckers, but never think about how they impact our lives. My dad is a truck driver and has been working with Roadway for 31 years now. He loves it and is considering training new ones once he retires. No one thinks about them until a truck is forced to squeeze in a lane or throws water on them in the rain. How many times do you think, "man, that truck driver is doing a great job!"?

Ben
11-27-2006, 01:36 PM
I haven't seen the movie or read the book, so I can't really add anything useful ... :Oops:

and I think Jesus went to Japan and is buried there. :scared:Hindus believe he visited India as a teenager.

Bill!
11-27-2006, 01:39 PM
I think its hilarious to call out the Da Vinci Code as being lies (when the book itself states its a work of fiction) and saying that the Bible is where the facts are. If any book needs to be called out for lying to people, its the Bible. Maybe they should occupy themselves with correcting that problem.

Ben
11-27-2006, 01:50 PM
I think its hilarious to call out the Da Vinci Code as being lies (when the book itself states its a work of fiction) and saying that the Bible is where the facts are. If any book needs to be called out for lying to people, its the Bible. Maybe they should occupy themselves with correcting that problem.I don't think it matters whether the Bible contains actual facts or not. To them, they are facts. This is sweet justice for all the trampling they did over evolution in the last 150 years, and I hope it gets worse and worse as Dan Brown keeps producing novels.

jason hissong
11-27-2006, 01:55 PM
And it's *still* a terrible book.

Ben
11-27-2006, 01:58 PM
And it's *still* a terrible book.Don't worry. We all know you didn't like the book that everyone else liked. You're special!

Bill!
11-27-2006, 02:00 PM
Don't worry. We all know you didn't like the book that everyone else liked. You're special!

He's INDY!!! It's the noir thing to do.

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 02:27 PM
Actually, if I remember correctly, in the movie (I didn't read the book), they test her against MARY'S DNA. Mary... the prostitute!!! How is that proof that she's related to Jesus? Am I wrong? It's been a while since I saw the movie.

Duh, because Mary Magdalene was no ho, just an awful house wife who wouldn't stay in the kitchen. It was the evil Vatican who made her one in retrospect out of spite! :crazy:

Ben
11-27-2006, 02:28 PM
Duh, because Mary Magdalene was no ho, just an awful house wife who wouldn't stay in the kitchen. It was the evil Vatican who made her one in retrospect out of spite! :crazy:But... but showing that someone alive today is related to Mary doesn't prove she married Jesus and wasn't a whore!!!!

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 02:35 PM
I think its hilarious to call out the Da Vinci Code as being lies (when the book itself states its a work of fiction) and saying that the Bible is where the facts are. If any book needs to be called out for lying to people, its the Bible. Maybe they should occupy themselves with correcting that problem.

Come on, Bill. You get out of the Bible what you put into it.

The OT is an ancient world history of a people in the vein of chronicles and vitae (supernatural elements) that is the basis for a faith. The NT is an updated ancient history for a splinter group of that original faith. While it was edited to the point that the original may be lost or highly obscured (to ensure survival), it's still still a world history in the sense ascribed to it before Gibbons and Ranke led the way to a modern field of history - which at the same time is the basis for another faith.

What people have made of the Bible over the last two millennia may be what you can decry, your red hot rage for the "lying" Bible is clearly misplaced.

Bill!
11-27-2006, 02:39 PM
What people have made of the Bible over the last two millennia may be what you can decry.

I figured that went without saying. That's what I meant.

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 02:41 PM
But... but showing that someone alive today is related to Mary doesn't prove she married Jesus and wasn't a whore!!!!

What if the last descendant of Mary Magdalene can't cook and has Jesus' Wolverine healing factor? What then? I tell you, it was Vatican-ian spite for terrible house keeping and sass!

Ben
11-27-2006, 02:43 PM
What if the last descendant of Mary Magdalene can't cook and has Jesus' Wolverine healing factor? What then? I tell you, it was Vatican-ian spite for terrible house keeping and sass!I guess the only way to tell is to kill her and see if she rises again a few days later. In fact, we should probably just kill lots of people and see if any of them are decended from Jesus. I'm crazy!

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 02:50 PM
I guess the only way to tell is to kill her and see if she rises again a few days later. In fact, we should probably just kill lots of people and see if any of them are decended from Jesus. I'm crazy!

Even so, Jebus also had YOU on his mind when he was on the cross. :D

Marcdachamp
11-27-2006, 04:07 PM
It always amazes me that people get upset over a movie that was poorly written and poorly acted. I'm catholic and the only reason I was offended was because they charged me almost $30 to see it. :-?

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 04:14 PM
It always amazes me that people get upset over a movie that was poorly written and poorly acted. I'm catholic and the only reason I was offended was because they charged me almost $30 to see it. :-?

That isn't enough to get upset?

ClintP
11-27-2006, 04:35 PM
It always amazes me that people get upset over a movie that was poorly written and poorly acted. I'm catholic and the only reason I was offended was because they charged me almost $30 to see it. :-?

$30? What are you a nutto? I rented it for $3.

Anna
11-27-2006, 04:50 PM
It always amazes me that people get upset over a movie that was poorly written and poorly acted.

Religious issues notwithstanding, the list of "facts" that precedes The Da Vinci Code is anything but factual. (Brown hubristically claims that "all descriptions of artwork, architecture, documents and secret rituals" in the novel are accurate. When they're not.)

That's enough to make some (non-religious) scholars who know better go all, "bitch, please".

Also: his prose and storytelling suck. That's very upsetting on its own, especially if you paid for the book.

Edited: My point being that, if Dan Brown simply removed the disingenuous introduction where he lists the "FACTS", he probably wouldn't have half as many critics.

Thomas Mauer
11-27-2006, 05:05 PM
Religious issues notwithstanding, the list of "facts" that precedes The Da Vinci Code is anything but factual. (Brown hubristically claims that "all descriptions of artwork, architecture, documents and secret rituals" in the novel are accurate. When they're not.)

That's enough to make some (non-religious) scholars who know better go all, "bitch, please".

Edited: My point being that, if Dan Brown simply removed the disingenuous introduction where he lists the "FACTS", he probably wouldn't have half as many critics.

:heart:

Marcdachamp
11-27-2006, 06:31 PM
$30? What are you a nutto? I rented it for $3.

I took my girlfriend. Between tickets, drinks and popcorn, $30 seems close.

And yeah, I can see getting upset over it, but everyone was worried that this would lead to mass hysteria in the church. Maybe if Tom Hanks remembered he has talent for 5 minutes it could've been saved.