Ronin's Identity Revealed in today's New Avengers SPOILERS

[Michael John Wheeler]

God damn it, spoilers. Don't yell at me this time. :x

I was getting very annoyed with this whole Ronin thing--over a year and a half of teasing us. I just lost interest. I was able to avoid all the spoilers though.

With Ronin finally being revealed, I find that I'm very happy about it again. I've always liked Echo and I'm glad to see her being used again. This is like the Sentry, as far as I'm concerned.

I hope that she doesn't stay in Japan for very long because I definitely want to see more of her soon.

Bendis, you did good, and this completely makes up for the fucking long wait 8)

[Gregory]

Let's not call this a redundant post; let's instead call it an echo.

[Patton]

it's not redundant. this is someone's perspective who READ it.

[Jew Mafia]

disappointing, thats how im going to describe the issue, and not so much for the reveal really.

[Gregory]

it's not redundant. this is someone's perspective who READ it.

What would keep this from being redundant are some answers to the questions posted yesterday about potential issues this person will have working with the other Avengers. Are any of those addressed in the comic?

And here's a question stemming from the original post: If Ronin stays in Japan, then this was a glorified guest stint for a few issues, much like the use of Sentry. They're in the title, but are they in the group?

[Ziolko]

I still wish it was Hank Pym so I could write the Giant Ninja vs Ant Ninja spin-off featuring a Cyborg Pirate Batroc the Leaper who steals the Pym pills and has his genes spliced with One of Red Ghost's apes which causes him to die then he's resurected by Brother Voodoo so that he can become a Giant French Robot Pirate Ninja Monkey Zombie.

;)

[Michael John Wheeler]

disappointing, thats how im going to describe the issue, and not so much for the reveal really.

Really? I enjoyed the teasing about it between Spider-Man and Luke Cage in the Quinn Jet. The "I hate that joke" was very funny just because of all the shit Bendis gets about it.

[A.Huerta]

Echo is lame. This is the one character I want off the team. If the next arc isnt better I'm dropping it.

[TIP]

I still wish it was Hank Pym so I could write the Giant Ninja vs Ant Ninja spin-off featuring a Cyborg Pirate Batroc the Leaper who steals the Pym pills and has his genes spliced with One of Red Ghost's apes which causes him to die then he's resurected by Brother Voodoo so that he can become a Giant French Robot Pirate Ninja Monkey Zombie.

;)


that's awesome

:lol:

T

[nihilance]

My question is did Finch even know he was drawing a woman the past few issues before the page where she took off her mask?

[weinblsIV]

Echo is lame. This is the one character I want off the team. If the next arc isnt better I'm dropping it.

i just did.

[Jew Mafia]

Really? I enjoyed the teasing about it between Spider-Man and Luke Cage in the Quinn Jet. The "I hate that joke" was very funny just because of all the shit Bendis gets about it.

I found that joke pretty tired myself. I just didnt like having a big reveal(dont mind who it was btw) and then the next page jumps to something completely different. I would have liked to have seen some reaction to the reveal.

[Shwicaz]

And here's a question stemming from the original post: If Ronin stays in Japan, then this was a glorified guest stint for a few issues, much like the use of Sentry. They're in the title, but are they in the group?


the issue of Ronin and who Ronin may be working for (now or the future) was brought up by Cap.

[Michael John Wheeler]

What would keep this from being redundant are some answers to the questions posted yesterday about potential issues this person will have working with the other Avengers. Are any of those addressed in the comic?

...what?


And here's a question stemming from the original post: If Ronin stays in Japan, then this was a glorified guest stint for a few issues, much like the use of Sentry. They're in the title, but are they in the group?

I think they are. They spoke about how the Sentry just wasn't ready yet and they can't wait for him to be able to beat all the ninjas. As for Echo, they're going to fund and support her. She's a part of the group as far as I'm concerned.

[nihilance]

the issue of Ronin and who Ronin may be working for (now or the future) was brought up by Cap.
Are you talking about the last page? Because I thought he was talking to Jessica.

[A.Huerta]

...what?

Cap has a problem with Killers. Appearantly the "leader" has no say... LAME!

[Gregory]

...what?

How can she understand what Spidey and Iron-Man say? Is that addressed? If she's staying in Japan, one could say she's not going to be around them long enough for it to be a problem.

[Michael John Wheeler]

Are you talking about the last page? Because I thought he was talking to Jessica.

He was.

[Shwicaz]

Are you talking about the last page? Because I thought he was talking to Jessica.


:Oops:

my mistake, you are correct.

[Michael John Wheeler]

How can she understand what Spidey and Iron-Man say? Is that addressed?

Okay, I hadn't realized that. That's... rather odd.

[Ray G.]

Eh. I haven't read the issue yet, but I'm not impressed with the choice of character. Still, any character can be written well, so I'll give it a chance. :?

[Kefky]

Um, they didn't even bother explaining about the suit and the hearing thing? :-?

[Cth]

Yep, love the character, but there needs to be some serious coordination with the art team if you're going to pull off something like this.

[AAlgar]

I still wish it was Hank Pym so I could write the Giant Ninja vs Ant Ninja spin-off featuring a Cyborg Pirate Batroc the Leaper who steals the Pym pills and has his genes spliced with One of Red Ghost's apes which causes him to die then he's resurected by Brother Voodoo so that he can become a Giant French Robot Pirate Ninja Monkey Zombie.

;)

Every part of that would be less disappointing than this reveal.

[Brad Gullickson]

Why did she need to wear the suit?

[AAlgar]

I will say this though: as much as it annoyed me that it dragged on for so long, it was probably the best-kept secret in comics till about a month ago.

[Jonny Z]

My question is did Finch even know he was drawing a woman the past few issues before the page where she took off her mask?

all i can say is that ronin's body looks remarkably like the body of namor on the cover of the new issue of ultimate fantastic four that came out today.



marvel really needs to get their shit together when coordinating covers, artists, writers, and throwing them all into the hype machine.


does anyone have those old USA today quotes from like a year ago where they talk about how ronin was a movie property with something made already or in development?

i'm curious to see if they made a quick change in character late in the development process of this arc.

and speaking of this arc, does anyone else really care what happened? i feel like there was a decent story buried by the lame hype over who Ronin is.

[Jonny Z]

Why did she need to wear the suit?

to conceal her identity :roll:

[Michael John Wheeler]

and speaking of this arc, does anyone else really care what happened? i feel like there was a decent story buried by the lame hype over who Ronin is.

The story was very fun. Ninjas. Come on! :D

[Gregory]

Why did she need to wear the suit?

Her: Does this make me look fat?
Spidey: It makes you look like 50 Cent.

[TIP]

Luh-aim.

T

[Kefky]

Well, let's face it guys, this doesn't have anything to do with editing coordination, or writer-artists relationship. Bendis just wanted to keep the identity a secret and made her look like a man. Extremely cheap, yes, but that's how it goes.

[Jonny Z]

The story was very fun. Ninjas. Come on! :D

thats an interesting point.

http://www.impawards.com/1992/posters/three_ninjas.jpg

not.

[a_garza]

severely disapointed

[Randomus]

They addressed the issue of her not being able to read Iron Man's lips. Did you people even read this issue?

Geez. It's like there's such a massive hard-on for hating this title that it's blinding people to what's right there on the page.

I, for one, enjoyed this issue AND the revelation of Ronin's identity.

[Greenville 90210]

Why did she need to wear the suit?

Um...so people would read the last year's worth of Avenger's comics.

I thought it was the female white tiger for a little while...

[Jonny Z]

They addressed the issue of her not being able to read Iron Man's lips. Did you people even read this issue?


eh? what??? i think i missed something

[mayhemspider]

is there any explaination why she wears the suit as opposed to dressing her own gender? is crossdressing one of her proclivities? never was in dd....

[Greenville 90210]

is there any explaination why she wears the suit as opposed to dressing her own gender? is crossdressing one of her proclivities? never was in dd....

She wanted people to think she was either DD, Electra, or Iron fist. Echo is really into comic sales.

[Raphael J]

Well, when I read the Wizard stuff with Finch and Bendis doing the director's commentary on the first arc of New Avengers, I noticed that Finch really didn't read ahead/sometimes added his own thing when pencilling (Jigsaw, for example), so it could be that Finch didn't know about the reveal until the issue it was revealed in.

[Dermie]

is there any explaination why she wears the suit as opposed to dressing her own gender?

No explanation given in this issue, but presumably she wanted to confuse her enemies and prevent them from realizing who she was. By disguising her gender, she makes it less likely that they'll be able to figure out who it really is.

[Greenville 90210]

No explanation given in this issue, but presumably she wanted to confuse her enemies and prevent them from realizing who she was. By disguising her gender, she makes it less likely that they'll be able to figure out who it really is.

They wouldn't know or care who she is...right?

I wonder what she used to make the buldge in her tights? Did she move her tits down to her crotch? Her legs are pretty muscular...maybe it's some shit Reed Richards made...

:-?

[Randomus]

They wouldn't know or care who she is...right?

I wonder what she used to make the buldge in her tights? Did she move her tits down to her crotch? Her legs are pretty muscular...maybe it's some shit Reed Richards made...

:-?
I would assume it's something super high-tech, like a cup.

I know, it's crazy.

[Greenville 90210]

I would assume it's something super high-tech, like a cup.

I know, it's crazy.

It's a cup that picks up audio and translates it into brainwaves that go through the fake muscles and into the brain?

Reed fucking Richards likes dressing girls up like guys.

[Randomus]

It's a cup that picks up audio and translates it into brainwaves that go through the fake muscles and into the brain?

Reed fucking Richards likes dressing girls up like guys.
No, she reads lips.

Read the reveal page. Actually read it.

[NickT]

does anyone have those old USA today quotes from like a year ago where they talk about how ronin was a movie property with something made already or in development?
Bendis said it wasn't true.

[JPKakinuma]

Prediction: One of the two female characters with black hair will get a haircut very soon (reverse sentry situation). My $ is on Echo. The last page of this comic was confusing because of this.

[TheKraken]

Making her look like a man was cheap and lame. And I don't get how she's supposed to have as much info on The Hand and such things as Matt. No one would cop to it, but I'd almost believe it was going to be Matt but too many people guessed it so it was changed to Echo.

The pointlessness of the suit is really heightened by how she points out herself to the Avengers that she's not some one they would've heard of. If they wouldn't know who she is, why would anyone else? Why dress up like a man? Other than to fuel the hype, of course...

I've loved this book so far, but between this cheap-ass reveal and Mike Deodato scheduled to start pencilling, I may be dropping it, too...

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

My question is did Finch even know he was drawing a woman the past few issues before the page where she took off her mask?
You read the Wizard behind the scenes interview about NA 1-6 and that other online interview and you have to ask that. More specifically if he knew the nature of the character and how that would affect some specifics of illutrating interactions.

Well with the scene where Ronin's back is to Cap when he asks a question that is in turn answered, you have to ask.
I did take note in the new issue where Iron Man was speaking to Ronin and then Cap would in turn ask the question so his lips could be read.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

I found that joke pretty tired myself. I just didnt like having a big reveal(dont mind who it was btw) and then the next page jumps to something completely different. I would have liked to have seen some reaction to the reveal.
There's no reaction because no one knows who the character is. What did you want them to say. "Oh." They knew DD and Cap vouched for the character and that Ronin seemed to get some things done. Cap at best had known Ronin a few hours before the mission began. Ronin probably could have walked without revealing actually. Spiderwoman is much more important and had to be addressed.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

...what?



I think they are. They spoke about how the Sentry just wasn't ready yet and they can't wait for him to be able to beat all the ninjas. As for Echo, they're going to fund and support her. She's a part of the group as far as I'm concerned.
I like that Wolverine was not available/ did not make himself available for a mission that is just the type of thing you'd think he would be on the team for. And I like that Sentry is not capable of being on call to wrap things up in minutes because he's unreliable for the time being. The group is still growing and will have to soon decide what is and isn't working.

The way the issue ended, Echo wasn't so much a part of the group as finishing something she said she'd do but was unsatisfied with her role in. She's following up in Japan, not as an Avenger, but as someone who took a job for a friend and wan't to see it through. Also, she refused Stark's amenities so...I dunno.

[Raphael J]

You read the Wizard behind the scenes interview about NA 1-6 and that other online interview and you have to ask that. More specifically if he knew the nature of the character and how that would affect some specifics of illutrating interactions.

Well with the scene where Ronin's back is to Cap when he asks a question that is in turn answered, you have to ask.
I did take note in the new issue where Iron Man was speaking to Ronin and then Cap would in turn ask the question so his lips could be read.

Yep. I agree completely. I don't know if Finch knew about this, because the way the panels are layed out in this new issue, and the way Cap relays it doesn't match up at all with what we were seeing previously.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

How can she understand what Spidey and Iron-Man say? Is that addressed? If she's staying in Japan, one could say she's not going to be around them long enough for it to be a problem.
She apparently cannot understand Iron Man directly. The issue shows that much. As for Spiderman, I don't know.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Yep. I agree completely. I don't know if Finch knew about this, because the way the panels are layed out in this new issue, and the way Cap relays it doesn't match up at all with what we were seeing previously.
Does an artist have the luxury of not knowing? Honestly how could he not know? I could believe that he did not know about Echo's handicap rather than not knowing she was a woman. Guess we'll never know.

[Pat Loika]

Does an artist have the luxury of not knowing? Honestly how could he not know? I could believe that he did not know about Echo's handicap rather than not knowing she was a woman. Guess we'll never know.

As much as I enjoyed the book itself...I can't help but wonder if the editor was keeping the artist in the know through the process. In the end, the editor should know what's happening, and is responsible for keeping everyone on the same page.

P.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Why did she need to wear the suit?
To not get killed by ninjas as much?

If I thought I'd get a no-prize I'd say that the helmet had stuff in it so she could understand a couple of her team mates through some kind of tech. But I'm SO not going to go there. ;)

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

As much as I enjoyed the book itself...I can't help but wonder if the editor was keeping the artist in the know through the process. In the end, the editor should know what's happening, and is responsible for keeping everyone on the same page.

P.
Honestly with the state of some of Marvel's material today, I don't know what an editor's actual job is anymore. Coordination is not as tight as it could be. We have Silver Samurai in Rogue that is completely different from what we have in NA to the point where NA's editor may very well not have known that the character was used in that book recently. And we have Silver Samurai in Wolverine this very week getting the business from Wolverine in ways that don't exactly jive with what we saw in NA. Which was really, really good material for SS. All I know is there's a lot of editors and assistants to assistants, and I don't know what they all do. Breevort can't be everywhere at once, nor should he have to.

[Corwin: Bear Fighter]

I've loved this book so far, but between this cheap-ass reveal and Mike Deodato scheduled to start pencilling, I may be dropping it, too...

Oh, fuck me, Deodato's next? I can't wait. :-?

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

They addressed the issue of her not being able to read Iron Man's lips. Did you people even read this issue?

Geez. It's like there's such a massive hard-on for hating this title that it's blinding people to what's right there on the page.

I, for one, enjoyed this issue AND the revelation of Ronin's identity.
Its the internet. You know protocol here. One guy scans the issue while watching tv and talking on the phone, posts what he's pretty sure happened, then like 50 people who have not read the issue or the 4 before it begin a running commentary. What are you new at this?

[BWC Boston]

The reveal makes little sense and with the cheap fake-outs leading up to it, leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Which would be fine, except not much happened in the arc to distract from it.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

eh? what??? i think i missed something
Read it again. Iron Man talks and Cap boils what he's said down with less words. The there is an answer.

[Randomus]

She apparently cannot understand Iron Man directly. The issue shows that much. As for Spiderman, I don't know.
She does not respond to Spider-Man directly. She only responds to his query when Luke Cage repeats it, and then seemingly ignores Spider-Man's continued questions.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

is there any explaination why she wears the suit as opposed to dressing her own gender? is crossdressing one of her proclivities? never was in dd....
If she wore her usual, she would have been dead in the first part of the arc. Dead.

[The Human Target]

Yeah I read this today. Meh. And why the fuck are the Sentry and logan even on the team when they... aren't really on the team?

[Randomus]

Yeah I read this today. Meh. And why the fuck are the Sentry and logan even on the team when they... aren't really on the team?
Wolverine wasn't needed and Sentry is still recovering from his massive reality shift. Bendis did say we would be seeing a rotating roster.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Well, when I read the Wizard stuff with Finch and Bendis doing the director's commentary on the first arc of New Avengers, I noticed that Finch really didn't read ahead/sometimes added his own thing when pencilling (Jigsaw, for example), so it could be that Finch didn't know about the reveal until the issue it was revealed in.
Communication. I know everyone is a professional, but maybe sometimes someone has to say "hey you know what's what, right?" Especially after the first initial ripples ala Breakout. I got no problem, but as of right now there are things that certain "junk yard dogs," if you will, can grab onto and bark at due to the artistic delivery.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

She does not respond to Spider-Man directly. She only responds to his query when Luke Cage repeats it, and then seemingly ignores Spider-Man's continued questions.
BAM! Next topic.

[The Human Target]

Wolverine wasn't needed and Sentry is still recovering from his massive reality shift. Bendis did say we would be seeing a rotating roster.

But.... they're on all the group covers...... and stuff.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Yeah I read this today. Meh. And why the fuck are the Sentry and logan even on the team when they... aren't really on the team?
I like that angle. Marshal Stark gives out badges to a bunch of lil deputies and one can't be bothered to pick up the phone and the other could be a serious liability until he is 100% straightened out, if that's even possible. That works for me, but it needs to be part of the story. The NA need to realize that some things are not working out.

[Randomus]

But.... they're on all the group covers...... and stuff.
I'm guessing this is just marketing stuff, really. I get the impression that Sentry will be the team's new Thor-- he's not around much, but when they need a heavy hitter he shows up to lay the smack down. Wolverine will probably be around when there's dirty work to do.

I don't know how much longer Spider-Woman will be a regular, either.

[Raphael J]

I like that angle. Marshal Stark gives out badges to a bunch of lil deputies and one can't be bothered to pick up the phone and the other could be a serious liability until he is 100% straightened out, if that's even possible. That works for me, but it needs to be part of the story. The NA need to realize that some things are not working out.

This is absolutely true. This team isn't winning. They didn't win at the Raft, at the Savage Land, with the Sentry, in House of M, and in this latest arc. They've been getting their asses handed to them or have to have large amounts of help. This needs to be part of where this team is headed.

And, just as a personal gripe if they're going to say that they are going to follow through with problems, they should have checked for Madam Hydra. Just saying. Iron Man could have scanned for her himself, easily.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Wolverine wasn't needed and Sentry is still recovering from his massive reality shift. Bendis did say we would be seeing a rotating roster.
Gotta fight you on that. Wolverine not needed? Iron Man himself called him a modern day samurai and when its time to knock on Silver Samurai's door (the guy who was almost Wolverine's half brother-in-law) AND fight ninjas (see Wolverine mini series) the guy is nowhere to be found. He should have to hear about that, but I doubt anyone will dare bring it up.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

I'm guessing this is just marketing stuff, really. I get the impression that Sentry will be the team's new Thor-- he's not around much, but when they need a heavy hitter he shows up to lay the smack down. Wolverine will probably be around when there's dirty work to do.

I don't know how much longer Spider-Woman will be a regular, either.
I predict that Spiderwoman has three issues of explaining to do. Either capturing more escapees or freeing her from whatever hold whomever has on her.

Sentry is good for big deals, but the will always be a risk with letting him help.

Wolverine should be in situations that do not play to his strong suits. Covert stuff works for him, fighting the Wrecker doesn't work for his talents, but I enjoyed seeing that more than the usual Wolverine stuff. Unsual that still makes sense is what I expect from NA.

[The Human Target]

This is absolutely true. This team isn't winning. They didn't win at the Raft, at the Savage Land, with the Sentry, in House of M, and in this latest arc. They've been getting their asses handed to them or have to have large amounts of help. This needs to be part of where this team is headed.

And, just as a personal gripe if they're going to say that they are going to follow through with problems, they should have checked for Madam Hydra. Just saying. Iron Man could have scanned for her himself, easily.

Exactly. They suck ass and don't seem to notice it. They just assumed Viper/Madam hydra would live. What heroes, leaving a dangerous criminal to drown after they take the effort to capture her alive and if she escapes she'll kill and maim people. Go Team!

[Randomus]

Gotta fight you on that. Wolverine not needed? Iron Man himself called him a modern day samurai and when its time to knock on Silver Samurai's door (the guy who was almost Wolverine's half brother-in-law) AND fight ninjas (see Wolverine mini series) the guy is nowhere to be found. He should have to hear about that, but I doubt anyone will dare bring it up.
That's fair and true. It would have been better if I had said "Wolverine was busy in another 10 comics." ;)

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Prediction: One of the two female characters with black hair will get a haircut very soon (reverse sentry situation). My $ is on Echo. The last page of this comic was confusing because of this.
Ronin said that she was going straight back to Japan so it wasn't confusing to me at all. I understood that to be effective immediately due to the sensitive nature of the way things were left. I guess everyone reads everything differently....

[A.Huerta]

I dont buy this " Wolverines busy" crap. The whole team should be there, its the NEW AVENGERS. If this is going to be about rotating members then WTF? They all need to be there... as a whole. And if Sentrys on the team, then they need stronger villains along with bigger problems. The next arc better pick up or... PEACE OUT!

[Randomus]

Ronin said that she was going straight back to Japan so it wasn't confusing to me at all. I understood that to be effective immediately due to the sensitive nature of the way things were left. I guess everyone reads everything differently....
Also Ronin has a handprint on her face. Which Drew does not.

[Pat Loika]

I dont buy this " Wolverines busy" crap. The whole team should be there, its the NEW AVENGERS. If this is going to be about rotating members then WTF? They all need to be there... as a whole. And if Sentrys on the team, then they need stronger villains along with bigger problems. The next arc better pick up or... PEACE OUT!

Don't worry...there's going to be a huge cosmic level being coming soon.

And this is the first time I heard someone complain about having less Wolverine... :lol:

P.

[Raphael J]

Don't worry...there's going to be a huge cosmic level being coming soon.

And this is the first time I heard someone complain about having less Wolverine... :lol:

P.

Nah, I'm with him. The Ronin arc was a Wolverine mission. He was built for that sort of thing. Him not being involved at all bugged me a lot.

But, whatever. That's the way Ronin had to be introduced.

[A.Huerta]

Don't worry...there's going to be a huge cosmic level being coming soon.

And this is the first time I heard someone complain about having less Wolverine... :lol:

P.

Out of Marvel, I only pick up the Sentry, New Avengers and Marvel Team-up; so NA is the only Logan action I get.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

This is absolutely true. This team isn't winning. They didn't win at the Raft, at the Savage Land, with the Sentry, in House of M, and in this latest arc. They've been getting their asses handed to them or have to have large amounts of help. This needs to be part of where this team is headed.

And, just as a personal gripe if they're going to say that they are going to follow through with problems, they should have checked for Madam Hydra. Just saying. Iron Man could have scanned for her himself, easily.
The new Avengers have been getting thrown out of Woolworth's since day one. Tony Stark has personally saved the group or bought them time on multiple occasions. Cap has to see that. Spiderman is solid, he's smart and is getting used to playing with others fast. Years of Marvel Team Up has done that much for him. Cage hangs in even though he has been outgunned pretty much every time except for with getting the drop on the Wrecker. And I like how he's not at all good with diplomacy or the "proper channels" that Cap and Iron Man know all about. Spiderwoman is officially not to be trusted now. Iron Man is super-suspect. Mr. Can't Afford Avengers No More has been throwing around cash like crazy. New Quinjet that got smashed immediately, offering Wolverine and Ronin money. Savage Land cover up. Dubious. I predict that Iron Man will exit soon actually. Or at least not be a field guy. And once the group goes public? Expect some people to want to know if they can get in or not. Honestly, the NA are in no position to turn down vets like Wonder Man if he should ask. And of course Warbird/ Ms. Marvel.

[Pat Loika]

Out of Marvel, I only pick up the Sentry, New Avengers and Marvel Team-up; so NA is the only Logan action I get.

Ahh. I just found it strange, considering all the complaining about Logan being in the team. There should be more of him in the book soon, too. I was hoping to see him throw down with the Samurai...

P.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Exactly. They suck ass and don't seem to notice it. They just assumed Viper/Madam hydra would live. What heroes, leaving a dangerous criminal to drown after they take the effort to capture her alive and if she escapes she'll kill and maim people. Go Team!
Its not so much as Cap assumed that she was ailve because she was a villain than he immediately knew that what happened was no accident. That's how I read it. I'm ready for the NA to notice that they're not getting the job done. If the old Avengers were guilty of not following through, the new guys are doing it too. What was happening in the Savage Land was huge and still only the tip of the iceberg, yet they're trying to get more evidence it seems. And not telling anyone else what happened there. Viper likely had something arranged to pick her up since she allowed herself to be taken in the first place. But no life signs seemed good enough to call it a day. I don't think the jet even slowed down :lol:

[Raphael J]

The new Avengers have been getting thrown out of Woolworth's since day one. Tony Stark has personally saved the group or bought them time on multiple occasions. Cap has to see that. Spiderman is solid, he's smart and is getting used to playing with others fast. Years of Marvel Team Up has done that much for him. Cage hangs in even though he has been outgunned pretty much every time except for with getting the drop on the Wrecker. And I like how he's not at all good with diplomacy or the "proper channels" that Cap and Iron Man know all about. Spiderwoman is officially not to be trusted now. Iron Man is super-suspect. Mr. Can't Afford Avengers No More has been throwing around cash like crazy. New Quinjet that got smashed immediately, offering Wolverine and Ronin money. Savage Land cover up. Dubious. I predict that Iron Man will exit soon actually. Or at least not be a field guy. And once the group goes public? Expect some people to want to know if they can get in or not. Honestly, the NA are in no position to turn down vets like Wonder Man if he should ask. And of course Warbird/ Ms. Marvel.

Iron Man is pretty sketchy. He really is pushing things in a certain direction, seemingly manipulating the group to follow a certain trend that he wants. Honestly, who's to say he didn't know/find out about the Sentry's tower being there? Who's to say that was a coincidence?

[Raphael J]

Its not so much as Cap assumed that she was ailve because she was a villain than he immediately knew that what happened was no accident. That's how I read it. I'm ready for the NA to notice that they're not getting the job done. If the old Avengers were guilty of not following through, the new guys are doing it too. What was happening in the Savage Land was huge and still only the tip of the iceberg, yet they're trying to get more evidence it seems. And not telling anyone else what happened there. Viper likely had something arranged to pick her up since she allowed herself to be taken in the first place. But no life signs seemed good enough to call it a day. I don't think the jet even slowed down :lol:

That was hilarious. It's like a comedian waking up to a joke, but talking themselves out of writing it down because the pen is too far away.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

I dont buy this " Wolverines busy" crap. The whole team should be there, its the NEW AVENGERS. If this is going to be about rotating members then WTF? They all need to be there... as a whole. And if Sentrys on the team, then they need stronger villains along with bigger problems. The next arc better pick up or... PEACE OUT!
The deal with taking Wolverine on is that sometimes he's simply not going to be there. I know in comics we're used to Wolverine and Spiderman being in 50 completely different places at once, but I'm ok with Wolverine having X-men business which will always come first or personal business. Sometimes Spiderman is going to have to decline due to personal things. Its more real that way to me. Cap and Iron Man are pretty much always on duty and so is Cage for now. The other guys, if they have stuff to do, so be it. I like mixing up the team. What we've had for 13 issues, I doubt that this is the permanent team. The next team might make us forget all about this formation.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Ahh. I just found it strange, considering all the complaining about Logan being in the team. There should be more of him in the book soon, too. I was hoping to see him throw down with the Samurai...

P.
You can sort of in this week's Wolverine. Its in a different context though.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Iron Man is pretty sketchy. He really is pushing things in a certain direction, seemingly manipulating the group to follow a certain trend that he wants. Honestly, who's to say he didn't know/find out about the Sentry's tower being there? Who's to say that was a coincidence?
Iron Man has been pretty pushy. Ending the old Avengers then being so gung ho about a new fresh and clean deal. Odd.

[The Human Target]

Its not so much as Cap assumed that she was ailve because she was a villain than he immediately knew that what happened was no accident. That's how I read it. I'm ready for the NA to notice that they're not getting the job done. If the old Avengers were guilty of not following through, the new guys are doing it too. What was happening in the Savage Land was huge and still only the tip of the iceberg, yet they're trying to get more evidence it seems. And not telling anyone else what happened there. Viper likely had something arranged to pick her up since she allowed herself to be taken in the first place. But no life signs seemed good enough to call it a day. I don't think the jet even slowed down :lol:

Yeah, I mean they knew she escaped, and Cap thinks Spidey Woman is in on it. But yeah, they're just like "Oops! Let's go home and get into the sauna!"

[Randomus]

Iron Man has been pretty pushy. Ending the old Avengers then being so gung ho about a new fresh and clean deal. Odd.
I have been pretty curious about this, especially with his offers to fund things left and right this issue. I'd like to see it go somewhere.

I can't shake the feeling that it's somehow linked to Extremis.

[mayhemspider]

Nah, I'm with him. The Ronin arc was a Wolverine mission. He was built for that sort of thing. Him not being involved at all bugged me a lot.

But, whatever. That's the way Ronin had to be introduced.
but why? they could have easily introduced her as echo without needing the alias. it was pointless. so it was protection, big deal. it would have been a better story if she was critically wounded, at least then cap would have that hanging over his head. who's she hiding her identity from? nobody knows her! how does she know about the hand? she's from the bronx! it just struck me as a cheap marketing ploy by marvel and bendis. and the way some of you are speculating on what could be happening and all the inconsistancies in this title make me think any one of you could have plotted this better than brian. sorry, but thats how i feel.

[Raphael J]

I really hope Madame Hydra just keels over laughing at them the next time she sees them.

"You thought WHAT!? Dead?! HAH! Do...do you guys not know how this works? Aww...poor babies. Don't worry, I just went to where Santa and the Easter Bunny hang out. HAHAHAH"

But with more evil laughing.

[Randomus]

Yeah, I mean they knew she escaped, and Cap thinks Spidey Woman is in on it. But yeah, they're just like "Oops! Let's go home and get into the sauna!"
If you had the choice between chasing down a criminal in the middle of the ocean and hopping in a sauna with Jessica Drew and (rowr!!) Luke Cage, what would you choose? ;)

[mayhemspider]

Iron Man is pretty sketchy. He really is pushing things in a certain direction, seemingly manipulating the group to follow a certain trend that he wants. Honestly, who's to say he didn't know/find out about the Sentry's tower being there? Who's to say that was a coincidence?
i'd really love to see this go somewhere, but i honestly don't think it will. i think its just a plot hole.

[Raphael J]

but why? they could have easily introduced her as echo without needing the alias. it was pointless. so it was protection, big deal. it would have been a better story if she was critically wounded, at least then cap would have that hanging over his head. who's she hiding her identity from? nobody knows her! how does she know about the hand? she's from the bronx! it just struck me as a cheap marketing ploy by marvel and bendis. and the way some of you are speculating on what could be happening and all the inconsistancies in this title make me think any one of you could have plotted this better than brian. sorry, but thats how i feel.

Cap has way too much on his head right now. The guy needs to deal with the issues he already has.

And, honestly, she needs the protection. Even Taskmaster wears some extra layers.

Was it a cheap marketing ploy? In the eyes of some. But, it made sense when I read it. That doesn't mean I liked it or disliked it, but it made sense.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

i'd really love to see this go somewhere, but i honestly don't think it will. i think its just a plot hole.
Doesn't have to be. All comics are not yet written.

[mayhemspider]

Cap has way too much on his head right now. The guy needs to deal with the issues he already has.

And, honestly, she needs the protection. Even Taskmaster wears some extra layers.

Was it a cheap marketing ploy? In the eyes of some. But, it made sense when I read it. That doesn't mean I liked it or disliked it, but it made sense.
i read it and reread it, and it just seems cheap.

[A.Huerta]

The deal with taking Wolverine on is that sometimes he's simply not going to be there. I know in comics we're used to Wolverine and Spiderman being in 50 completely different places at once, but I'm ok with Wolverine having X-men business which will always come first or personal business. Sometimes Spiderman is going to have to decline due to personal things. Its more real that way to me. Cap and Iron Man are pretty much always on duty and so is Cage for now. The other guys, if they have stuff to do, so be it. I like mixing up the team. What we've had for 13 issues, I doubt that this is the permanent team. The next team might make us forget all about this formation.

This should be about these members, not new ones for kicks. I feel NA to be its own team book. These people assemble for the most important situations in the MU, regardless of wolverines and spideys problems. I dont care whats happening in the Other, cause this isnt happening at the same time. So Spidey should be there, along with the other characters. But if they do rotate constantly, then this isnt my kinda team.

[mayhemspider]

Doesn't have to be. All comics are not yet written.
this is the type of thing that makes me hope writers "borrow" and adapt ideas from their boards.

[Raphael J]

this is the type of thing that makes me hope writers "borrow" and adapt ideas from their boards.

I don't. God, there are some shitty, shitty ideas out there. For every solid one, you get a "DUDE! Teh Hawkeye should mix with Venom!!!"

[mayhemspider]

I don't. God, there are some shitty, shitty ideas out there. For every solid one, you get a "DUDE! Teh Hawkeye should mix with Venom!!!"
haha how do you think the other is going to end?

[The Human Target]

If you had the choice between chasing down a criminal in the middle of the ocean and hopping in a sauna with Jessica Drew and (rowr!!) Luke Cage, what would you choose? ;)

I'd catch Viper and bring her along.

I have a thing for women with odd coloured hair. :heybaby:

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

This should be about these members, not new ones for kicks. I feel NA to be its own team book. These people assemble for the most important situations in the MU, regardless of wolverines and spideys problems. I dont care whats happening in the Other, cause this isnt happening at the same time. So Spidey should be there, along with the other characters. But if they do rotate constantly, then this isnt my kinda team.
Well you sound like you want out anyway so, we'll see ya.

[Randomus]

I'd catch Viper and bring her along.

I have a thing for women with odd coloured hair. :heybaby:
Touché!

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

I don't. God, there are some shitty, shitty ideas out there. For every solid one, you get a "DUDE! Teh Hawkeye should mix with Venom!!!"
Hey, there are also some good ideas that come from the fan base too. I've seen them. I have no problem with great minds thinking alike.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

haha how do you think the other is going to end?
He's going to have a super-other eye that can see spirit animal totems. He'll have to wear special sunglasses though. Even indoors and at night.

[Raphael J]

Hey, there are also some good ideas that come from the fan base too. I've seen them. I have no problem with great minds thinking alike.

I know. That's why I said for every one.

My point was, I don't want writers taking orders from fan bases. Sure, if there are good ideas, riff off of it. But it isn't a fucking drive thru.

[mayhemspider]

I know. That's why I said for every one.

My point was, I don't want writers taking orders from fan bases. Sure, if there are good ideas, riff off of it. But it isn't a fucking drive thru.
haha thats not what i was implying at all. but a good counterargument to me would be the other. i'm not even kidding now. i had an idea like it when i was like 10. i thought it came true last year durring disassembled. but this is more like what i thought.

[Randomus]

He's going to have a super-other eye that can see spirit animal totems. He'll have to wear special sunglasses though. Even indoors and at night.
I actually think it will end with
his eye being replaced by Peter Griffin.

[mayhemspider]

I actually think it will end with
his eye being replaced by Peter Griffin.
"hey wheat-thins, take off your top!"-Quagemyer as sandy dunkin's eye

[Mark Mavro (kryptic6)]

It was a good arc. Very enjoyable. I think the hype just distracted people. If we had gone into the arc not knowing anything about "Ronin" then nobody'd be bitching. Unfortunately, the internet doesn't allow for that, and Marvel has no choice but to play along and hype the hell out of stuff for the sake of sales. The problem is that Marvel overhypes stuff SO in advance that people get sick of it. I bet this arc got more buyers because of the hype. The trade off is that some people are unsatisfied now. I for one thought I got my money's worth. Well done, B.

[NickT]

The pointlessness of the suit is really heightened by how she points out herself to the Avengers that she's not some one they would've heard of. If they wouldn't know who she is, why would anyone else?
Because she has both Fisk connections and has danced and played pianos to packed audiences?

[NickT]

I dont buy this " Wolverines busy" crap. The whole team should be there, its the NEW AVENGERS. If this is going to be about rotating members then WTF? They all need to be there... as a whole.
No they don't. I'd rather that there wasn't a situation where Bendis has to go "Oh, well all eight people must be here in this issue, even though three don't fit." Pick the members of the team you need and go with it.

[NickT]

This should be about these members, not new ones for kicks. I feel NA to be its own team book. These people assemble for the most important situations in the MU, regardless of wolverines and spideys problems. I dont care whats happening in the Other, cause this isnt happening at the same time. So Spidey should be there, along with the other characters. But if they do rotate constantly, then this isnt my kinda team.
I'd rather a team where some people are part time. Sentry makes the team too powerful for some fights, without him they're too weak for others. So, why not have him have his perfectly good reason for not being there 24/7? Seems better to me than "These 7 heroes live in a mansion and fight together all the time" :)

[anghus]

Um. I have such mixed feelings. The arc was fun, but Finch's art still kills it for me. I think he is arguably the worst artist working on a high profile book. His faces all look the same. The coloring also blows.

Yes, im real curious why Ronin looka lika man. Silly, silly stuff. No explination will cover it.

Bendis + Ninjas = awful comics. Didnt Daredevil: Ninja prove that to everyone?

I so want to like this comic. But man oh man. The art, plus gimmicky writing = get this the fuck off my pull list.

This book is going nowhere, fast. One year in, and we still dont know what the phunkin phunk is going on with Shield. Bendis = too much talky talky

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Um. I have such mixed feelings. The arc was fun, but Finch's art still kills it for me. I think he is arguably the worst artist working on a high profile book. His faces all look the same. The coloring also blows.

Yes, im real curious why Ronin looka lika man. Silly, silly stuff. No explination will cover it.

Bendis + Ninjas = awful comics. Didnt Daredevil: Ninja prove that to everyone?

I so want to like this comic. But man oh man. The art, plus gimmicky writing = get this the fuck off my pull list.

This book is going nowhere, fast. One year in, and we still dont know what the phunkin phunk is going on with Shield. Bendis = too much talky talky
I'll say that Finch was noticably improving with each issue. Even people who are not fans of his are likely to agree with that much. High profile is very challenging. But his time is over now so that'sone less thing to talk about.

I've enjoyed NA from the start, but I'm ready for the real thing to begin. So far we've had the loose group form, go on a couple trips, and 99% of the time get their heads handed to them (expect for when Iron Man or someone not on the NA team saves them). Which I'm ok with, but its about time for the real story to begin now and I think its on the way after the Spiderwoman arc. Many of the ways the NA are trying to do things simply are not working and I want to read about the group realizing that. New members are in the wings.

Ronin is there to be called upon when needed but is hopefully not there all the time, because that skill isn't always needed AND most importantly the group doesn't know who that is. I guess its masks on for most people when Ronin is about.

To me the Sentry is still a huge liability. And I think he'll remain that way for the time being to keep him from being able tosolve most conflicts in a minutes. That's the kind of thing that makes Sentry different from Superman for those who wonder.

Cap or Iron Man, one has got to go. Iron Man is having a ball paying for any and everything (which was something that wasn't supposed to be able to happen anymore) and he personally saves the team pretty often too. I figure that perhaps Cap will not agree with Stark withholding the Savage Land info from the Illuminati peers who may have bene in a position to help. Or if in fact Cap has never heard of such a group, he likely won't take that well either. As close as Cap and Iron Man are, they have had serious beef over the years.

As for Shield, well Secret War should be in our hands in a couple weeks and in theory with that over, all kinds of progression is possible in many titles.

[A.Huerta]

I'd rather a team where some people are part time. Sentry makes the team too powerful for some fights, without him they're too weak for others. So, why not have him have his perfectly good reason for not being there 24/7? Seems better to me than "These 7 heroes live in a mansion and fight together all the time" :)


The challenge is to write a villain/villains and a story that CAN take down the New Avengers. The Sentry may be strong, but I know badguys can be written to take him down. Ninjas? Not a very fresh idea to me. Lately there have been too many ninja stories coming out. I rather read about the current team and their situation with eachother; along wit villains who are crazy enough to take them down with everybody in it.

Also we already have a book with a rotating roster, it's called Marvel Team-Up.

[Hypester23]

I think that Sentry's power is going to be addressed in his own series. I'm betting he'll be powered down so that he can't just take out everyone in one shot.

[Olivier E.]

No they don't. I'd rather that there wasn't a situation where Bendis has to go "Oh, well all eight people must be here in this issue, even though three don't fit." Pick the members of the team you need and go with it.

but then we have something like wolverine 36 where he takes the whole issue to find silver samurai and he was so so hard to find :bored:

He appeared in 3 comics this week :no:

[anghus]

ok seriously. What did Ronin really do?

Went to Japan, tracked down Silver Samurai, AT HIS OWN HOUSE, and got beaten up by a bunch of ninjas.

Is this really something that required an expert in the Japanese Underworld. I mean christ, I could have done that.

"Excuse me, where is the house of the Harada Clan?... Over there? Thanks."

Then all i have to do is see the ninjas, run like hell back to the penthouse, and ive done everything Ronin did.

Does this require a secret, gender bending indentity?

It's kind of insulting when you think about it.

And what was with Murdock's reasons for not wanting to join.

"If i join the Avengers, you will all have targets on your back"

This is Captain America. He's had a target on his back since before pussy boy Matt Murdock was born. Seriously, what was his reasoning? Is murdock that self centered to think his involvement with the team would bring down Cap and Iron Man? What a weenie.

Weak, weak story. I'm dropping NA

[Hypester23]

ok seriously. What did Ronin really do?

Went to Japan, tracked down Silver Samurai, AT HIS OWN HOUSE, and got beaten up by a bunch of ninjas.

Is this really something that required an expert in the Japanese Underworld. I mean christ, I could have done that.

"Excuse me, where is the house of the Harada Clan?... Over there? Thanks."

Then all i have to do is see the ninjas, run like hell back to the penthouse, and ive done everything Ronin did.

Does this require a secret, gender bending indentity?

It's kind of insulting when you think about it.

And what was with Murdock's reasons for not wanting to join.

"If i join the Avengers, you will all have targets on your back"

This is Captain America. He's had a target on his back since before pussy boy Matt Murdock was born. Seriously, what was his reasoning? Is murdock that self centered to think his involvement with the team would bring down Cap and Iron Man? What a weenie.

Weak, weak story. I'm dropping NA


1.) She didn't just go up and ask. If you remember, she beat the heck out of a lot of Ninjas and had to find the place.

2.) Murdock is about to have everything fall out. He already saw the Avengers fall once, he doesn't want to be part of it again. Typical with the way he is with women--the crap crashing down in his life tends to also hit everyone around him.

[anghus]

no, she didnt ask. But i believe it was the house of the Harada clan, which basically means it's the Silver Samurai's place. It doesn't exactly take a rocket scientist or ninja underworld master to do the math on that one.

I'm not saying she didnt kick some ass, however, how pivotal was her role in this scenario.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

but then we have something like wolverine 36 where he takes the whole issue to find silver samurai and he was so so hard to find :bored:

He appeared in 3 comics this week :no:
And in each one its a different status that also happens to not line up with Rogue. And that should never happen. The same seemingly random character simply shouldn't be in three places on the shelf in the same week. And if it has to happen it should plug into whatever you saw in the highest profile place so that buyers might be tempted to pick up on the appearances they don't buy. That's top secret marketing that Marvel practically invented back in the day to make me that man I am today. Marvel definitely needs to tighten up in the specific respect.

[batmanbooyah]

ok seriously. What did Ronin really do?

Went to Japan, tracked down Silver Samurai, AT HIS OWN HOUSE, and got beaten up by a bunch of ninjas.

Is this really something that required an expert in the Japanese Underworld. I mean christ, I could have done that.

"Excuse me, where is the house of the Harada Clan?... Over there? Thanks."

Then all i have to do is see the ninjas, run like hell back to the penthouse, and ive done everything Ronin did.

Does this require a secret, gender bending indentity?

It's kind of insulting when you think about it.

And what was with Murdock's reasons for not wanting to join.

"If i join the Avengers, you will all have targets on your back"

This is Captain America. He's had a target on his back since before pussy boy Matt Murdock was born. Seriously, what was his reasoning? Is murdock that self centered to think his involvement with the team would bring down Cap and Iron Man? What a weenie.

Weak, weak story. I'm dropping NA



yeah and stark could bye off the press! like that one time with the hooker!


i wasn't anticipating the secret avenger. i think it's kinda weird to show the "secret" one months and months ahead of time. 2 months ahead alright, but 13 issues in? that's just kinda...weird. if it drummed up hype for the book, that's fine, but if it was some sort of storytelling technique...i'm lost.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

ok seriously. What did Ronin really do?

Went to Japan, tracked down Silver Samurai, AT HIS OWN HOUSE, and got beaten up by a bunch of ninjas.

Is this really something that required an expert in the Japanese Underworld. I mean christ, I could have done that.

"Excuse me, where is the house of the Harada Clan?... Over there? Thanks."

Then all i have to do is see the ninjas, run like hell back to the penthouse, and ive done everything Ronin did.

Does this require a secret, gender bending indentity?

It's kind of insulting when you think about it.

And what was with Murdock's reasons for not wanting to join.

"If i join the Avengers, you will all have targets on your back"

This is Captain America. He's had a target on his back since before pussy boy Matt Murdock was born. Seriously, what was his reasoning? Is murdock that self centered to think his involvement with the team would bring down Cap and Iron Man? What a weenie.

Weak, weak story. I'm dropping NA
DD felt that associating with anyone is a death sentence for their futures. And when they Avengers are supposedly getting back together to right wrongs, DD's presence would ruin them. Not as in super-villians like Stiltman attacking the group, but in the public eye and in certain situations where the NA will need government support or compliance.

[anghus]

i realize that, however...

wolverine is a member of the group, and he recently was a villain and has one of the shadiest pasts of any NA member.., and is not trusted by lots of people, especially governmental ones. Doesn't his involvement kind of put a lot of negative light on them?

Sentry is a threat... every hero in the MU saw what happens with him and the Void. Doesn't that also cast a bad shadow on the team?

Spiderman is one of the most mysterious figures in the MU (when not being unmasked every week). In fact, he was denied membership in the avengers a long time ago because the government knew so little about him.

Ronin is an assasain who worked for the kingpin.

Luke Cage was in Prison.

So do you think a blind D.A. from Hell's Kitchen would really be the straw that broke the camel's back, that his involvement would really cast aspursions on this super team. Iron Man even said to Wolverine "standing next to Captain America can do great things for your image" or something like that. So why, a couple of issues later, is that logic being flung from the rafters?


the more you read NA, the more it completely unravels.

logic is abandoned in order to introduce characters like Ronin that make no sense whatsoever.

dropped.

[A.Huerta]

i realize that, however...

wolverine is a member of the group, and he recently was a villain and has one of the shadiest pasts of any NA member.., and is not trusted by lots of people, especially governmental ones. Doesn't his involvement kind of put a lot of negative light on them?

Sentry is a threat... every hero in the MU saw what happens with him and the Void. Doesn't that also cast a bad shadow on the team?

Spiderman is one of the most mysterious figures in the MU (when not being unmasked every week). In fact, he was denied membership in the avengers a long time ago because the government knew so little about him.

Ronin is an assasain who worked for the kingpin.

Luke Cage was in Prison.

So do you think a blind D.A. from Hell's Kitchen would really be the straw that broke the camel's back, that his involvement would really cast aspursions on this super team. Iron Man even said to Wolverine "standing next to Captain America can do great things for your image" or something like that. So why, a couple of issues later, is that logic being flung from the rafters?


the more you read NA, the more it completely unravels.

logic is abandoned in order to introduce characters like Ronin that make no sense whatsoever.

dropped.

Pretty freakin' much.
:-?

[Pat Loika]

wolverine is a member of the group, and he recently was a villain and has one of the shadiest pasts of any NA member.., and is not trusted by lots of people, especially governmental ones. Doesn't his involvement kind of put a lot of negative light on them?

It's not public knowledge, and everyone involved knows it was brainwashing. Even SHIELD.


Sentry is a threat... every hero in the MU saw what happens with him and the Void. Doesn't that also cast a bad shadow on the team?

Nobody remembers the Sentry other than the heroes, no bad shadow on them from the public, and the heroes pretty much allowed it because he has regained control.


Spiderman is one of the most mysterious figures in the MU (when not being unmasked every week). In fact, he was denied membership in the avengers a long time ago because the government knew so little about him.

The Avengers are no longer a government/UN sanctioned unit. Thus, Spidey's presence is okay. In fact, he was a member in the older run, Spidey joined for the money.


Ronin is an assasain who worked for the kingpin.
Yes. But nobody else knows that other than Murdock OR the Kingpin. This may haunt her later on...


Luke Cage was in Prison.
Big deal. He's publicly known as a superhero. That's water under the bridge.


So do you think a blind D.A. from Hell's Kitchen would really be the straw that broke the camel's back, that his involvement would really cast aspursions on this super team. Iron Man even said to Wolverine "standing next to Captain America can do great things for your image" or something like that. So why, a couple of issues later, is that logic being flung from the rafters?
You forget that DD made the choice not to join, despite Cap's requests. It fits in with his character.

P.

[TheKraken]

Because she has both Fisk connections and has danced and played pianos to packed audiences?

That's hilarious. So, what, in her mind, The Avengers wouldn't know famous piano player Maya Lopez, but the fucking Hand might? :lol: Kingpin's first arch-nemesis Spider-Man wouldn't know Kingpin-connected Maya Lopez, but some random ninja might? Bullshit, man. At least try to come up with a convincing argument...

[A.Huerta]

I have to read more comics :lol:

[anghus]

but the public knows wolverine is a mutant. Not much love there.

still, matt murdock is a big pussy any way you look at it.

"the D.A. will go after the avengers... wah wah...."

these fuckers have the skrull empire, galactus, dr doom, magneto, and untold others on their asses every other day.

Are politicians really gonna scare Matt Murdock? I guess they have. What a pussy.

And for the record, that's what Cap should have said to him.

"Matt... stop being a pussy."

And now that i think about it, what a pussy to hand the job Cap asked him to do over to an ex-girlfriend.

It's official: Matt Murdock has no balls.

[Pat Loika]

It's official: Matt Murdock has no balls.

I'm going to have to agree with you on that. Yet somehow, he still gets some. :lol:

P.

[anghus]

That's hilarious. So, what, in her mind, The Avengers wouldn't know famous piano player Maya Lopez, but the fucking Hand might? :lol: Kingpin's first arch-nemesis Spider-Man wouldn't know Kingpin-connected Maya Lopez, but some random ninja might? Bullshit, man. At least try to come up with a convincing argument...

yeah. good point.

Ronin = TEH SUCK

and it still probably sold like 150,000 copies

[WinterRose]

Really? I enjoyed the teasing about it between Spider-Man and Luke Cage in the Quinn Jet. The "I hate that joke" was very funny just because of all the shit Bendis gets about it.


HAH!! Suddenly I get why Ronin was ignoring Spider-Man! Now THERE'S a communication problem!

[batmanbooyah]

"Matt...stop being a pussy"


hahaha


followed up by:


"i brought down the nazi's with jock itch you whore"

[anghus]

"Matt...stop being a pussy"


hahaha


followed up by:


"i brought down the nazi's with jock itch you whore"

How about Cap says this...

"Matt, i knew guys like you in the war, we called them THE FRENCH. Now go get your costume on before i smack the shit out of you."

[ds9]

Anyone hear how Mack feels about his character being an Avenger?

[Howlett]

How about Cap says this...

"Matt, i knew guys like you in the war, we called them THE FRENCH. Now go get your costume on before i smack the shit out of you."
That would only happen if it were Ultimate Cap :lol:

[batmanbooyah]

"but i'm blind"
"and i was frozen in ice for 50 years you shit! now put on that costume and vacuum my FUCKING CARPET!"

[Ashton]

I'm pleased with this revelation. whoda' thought?

[anghus]

who'da thought?

well, not many people since

RONIN LOOKED LIKE A MAN UNTIL THE MASK WAS TAKEN OFF

i mean, i know there are smart ways to conceal an identity for a comic book, but this is ridiculous.

Draw Ronin like man for a year, and then the mask comes off AND ITS A WOMAN.

Genius. Pure genius.

It makes sense in the kind of way that superman can put on glasses and no one knows it's him. Silly.

[batmanbooyah]

you want to date ronin, don't you?

[Michael John Wheeler]

Wheee, so much discussion.

There's good points towards logic errors in what's going on, but I've still been enjoying New Avengers from issue one. And I'll also say it again, even though everyone seems to be pooping on it: I loved the ninjas. :ninja:

[Ashton]

who'da thought?

well, not many people since

RONIN LOOKED LIKE A MAN UNTIL THE MASK WAS TAKEN OFF

i mean, i know there are smart ways to conceal an identity for a comic book, but this is ridiculous.

Draw Ronin like man for a year, and then the mask comes off AND ITS A WOMAN.

Genius. Pure genius.

It makes sense in the kind of way that superman can put on glasses and no one knows it's him. Silly.

I wonder if she'll keep up the muscle guy look or not.

[Ryan Elliott]

For all of you bitching about Wolverine not being there: He just got ALL his memories back. Every single one. I don't think he gives two shits about ANY of the teams he's on right now.


And the Ronin suit. Extra protection. Which explains why she was able to get up and fight so soon after getting pummled by ninja stars and arrows. And the design of the suit, probably has something to do with "Masterless Samurai."

And she didn't acknowledge Iron Man or Spider-Man in ANY issues becuase she couldn't read their lips.

*More to come after I read the thread again.

[Kefky]

For all of you bitching about Wolverine not being there: He just got ALL his memories back. Every single one. I don't think he gives two shits about ANY of the teams he's on right now.



Sorry, but NA's still pretty obviously taking place before hom. I do agree with the rest of your post, though. ;)

[Ryan Elliott]

Sorry, but NA's still pretty obviously taking place before hom. I do agree with the rest of your post, though. ;)



Even in Wolverine's own book. He's not dealing with anything but what's important to HIM. Nothing else matters.


I don't bother with major, major continuity. I enjoy books more.

[Kefky]

Even in Wolverine's own book. He's not dealing with anything but what's important to HIM. Nothing else matters.


I don't bother with major, major continuity. I enjoy books more.

Eh, I don't have a problem with it because all the stuff that the x-men goes trough is just ridicoulus. It's perfectly plausible that he was busy on that day, for that mission. And Tony said his membership would basically consist of him helping out when he could anyway. The way I see it, Cap, IM, Spidey, SW, Cage and Sentry are the six "main" members, and Wolvie and Ronin are back-ups.

[Ryan Elliott]

Eh, I don't have a problem with it because all the stuff that the x-men goes trough is just ridicoulus. It's perfectly plausible that he was busy on that day, for that mission. And Tony said his membership would basically consist of him helping out when he could anyway. The way I see it, Cap, IM, Spidey, SW, Cage and Sentry are the six "main" members, and Wolvie and Ronin are back-ups.


Yeah. They're the Reserve Avengers. Small number, yeah. But the team's just starting out.

[Lord Jermaine Retail]

Eh, I don't have a problem with it because all the stuff that the x-men goes trough is just ridicoulus. It's perfectly plausible that he was busy on that day, for that mission. And Tony said his membership would basically consist of him helping out when he could anyway. The way I see it, Cap, IM, Spidey, SW, Cage and Sentry are the six "main" members, and Wolvie and Ronin are back-ups.
I would agree with that. But change is coming likely with Spiderwoman and maybe Sentry. Ronin and Wolverine are reservists in my mind too. In theory this whole thing makes it possible for Ronin to appear other places to gain credibility with readers and other heroes. Perhaps in Wolverine's book. That would have been nice as he is in Japan now and he will never have met "Ronin" specifically. But its probably not in the editorial cards sadly.

[TheKraken]

And the Ronin suit. Extra protection.

Extra protection meticulously crafted to look like male muscles under tight material instead of regular body armor? This isn't Batman & Robin...

[Ryan Elliott]

Extra protection meticulously crafted to look like male muscles under tight material instead of regular body armor? This isn't Batman & Robin...



Of course, my answer to this is to make it look more organic.


People trying to shoot arrows at you or stab you won't take time to look for chinks or anything like that in armor that looks real.


"Theatricallity and deception are powerful weapons."