PDA

View Full Version : Immigrants should have to prove status when stopped, Branstad says



Ryan_ZOOM_Turner
07-14-2010, 03:41 PM
http://blogs.desmoinesregister.com/dmr/index.php/2010/07/14/immigrants-should-have-to-prove-status-when-stopped-branstad-says/

I can't believe people actually want to elect this guy governor again.


Immigrants should have to prove status when stopped, Branstad says



Immigrants should have to prove status when stopped, Branstad says

Blog post by Jason Clayworth • jclayworth@dmreg.com • July 14, 2010



Clarinda, Ia. — People in Iowa stopped on traffic violations should have to prove their citizenship status, Republican candidate for governor Terry Branstad said here today.


State auditor David Vaudt and Terry Branstad today in Clarinda.
“When people are stopped for a criminal violation or traffic violation, if they cannot show they are here legally, they ought to be detained and turned over to the federal government for deportation,” Branstad said.

Branstad cautioned, however, that he didn’t want Iowa taxpayers to be left paying the bill for the process.

“I think the challenge is getting the federal government to fulfill their end of the deal,” Branstad told a group of about 25 people at the Lied Public Library. “I don’t want the local property taxpayers to have to pay for them to be in a county jail for month after month after month. They need to step up and do their part of it.”

Immigration and deportation has traditionally been left to the federal government, which is part of the ongoing struggle with the recent law passed by Arizona that gives local police immigration enforcement powers.

Iowa lawmakers have also struggled with the issue for years. In 2008, for example, legislation was introduced but not passed that would have required all employers to verify the identity of each new employee within 10 days of hiring the person by obtaining a copy of his state-issued license or identification. Employers would have faced possible perjury charges for violations.

The 2008 proposal was a compromise from a similar proposal made by House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy, D-Des Moines. McCarthy’s version would have held business executives criminally liable.

McCarthy said the state ID plan was drafted to avoid possible constitutional challenges to the original proposal. It is possible that the U.S. Supreme Court could determine that the state is unable to go directly after business executives for violation of immigration laws. The updated proposal would have enabled prosecution of executives for perjury, not immigration law.

Branstad echoed the frustration about the state’s limited ability to enforce immigration law. If elected governor he said he would work to join other states in pushing the federal government to take action.

“I think there’s a movement all across this country saying it’s time,” Branstad said. “The states will enforce the law but the federal government also needs to do its part. And, frankly, we can seize their vehicles, too. .. and we can use part of that to pay the cost.”

Bill!
07-14-2010, 03:43 PM
Man. What is happening to this country?

You know who wants his country back? Me.

Treacle
07-14-2010, 05:39 PM
Immigrants should have to prove status when stopped, Branstad says

Goddamn, he's stupid.

Slewo.O
07-14-2010, 05:40 PM
Guy's a fucking racist and nutjob.

Ryan Elliott
07-14-2010, 05:41 PM
Wow.

Joe Kalicki
07-14-2010, 05:47 PM
I don't see how you could get a driver's license without a social security card.

Treacle
07-14-2010, 05:59 PM
I don't see how you could get a driver's license without a social security card.

Every state has different requirements to get a driver's license.

Having a social security makes it easier to get one, but it's not the only way to get it.

And that's not even getting into people who use SSNs which aren't their own.

Joe Kalicki
07-14-2010, 06:02 PM
Every state has different requirements to get a driver's license.

Having a social security makes it easier to get one, but it's not the only way to get it.

And that's not even getting into people who use SSNs which aren't their own.

Well I know I need one in Illinois.

Regardless, it doesn't strike me as unreasonable to put someone driving without a license through an extra status check. If they have one, though, I don't see how you could just assume they might not be a citizen without profiling.

Frozen Sooner
07-14-2010, 06:09 PM
Man. What is happening to this country?

You know who wants his country back? Me.

/thread

michealdark
07-14-2010, 06:13 PM
En Sabah FTW

Ben
07-14-2010, 06:18 PM
In many states you are not even required to show ID when stopped by a police officer (unless you're driving, in which case you do need to show a driver's license to prove you are allowed to drive).

Good & Evil
07-14-2010, 07:07 PM
So I have to go carrying my passport and birth certificate everywhere I go now? That's convenient.

edwardmblake
07-14-2010, 08:27 PM
How do you tell if someone is an immigrant?

Ferzhita
07-14-2010, 10:35 PM
This laws are xenophobic. Look, I´m from Barcelona, and Spain had one ot the most xenophobic inmigration laws in the world (I´m ashamed of that, BTW) That kind of persecution to inmigrants (both illegals and legals) is just a way to ignore the real problems of the world (at least in Spain) Why? Blame the imigrants for crime (for instance) instead of look te actual problem (poverty)

Here in Spain, bulgarians, rumanians and morocaans are pursued because of that kind of laws. I hate that, because they´re honest and hard-working people

Slewo.O
07-14-2010, 10:39 PM
How do you tell if someone is an immigrant?

If they don't look anything like this. They're definitely immigrints.

http://inconvenientbody.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/beaver.jpg

Ryan Elliott
07-14-2010, 10:44 PM
If they don't look anything like this. They're definitely immigrints.

http://inconvenientbody.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/beaver.jpg


So I guess we have to deport these mother fuckers.

Filthy illegals.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/02/06/fashion/shows/07row05.jpg

Slewo.O
07-14-2010, 10:45 PM
So I guess we have to deport these mother fuckers.

Filthy illegals.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/02/06/fashion/shows/07row05.jpg

These will be the defenders of our nation.

http://epistemysics.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/kkk.jpg

artimoff
07-14-2010, 10:46 PM
Here in Spain, bulgarians, rumanians and morocaans are pursued because of that kind of laws. I hate that, because they´re honest and hard-working people

I don't blame a single illegal immigrant for wanting to come to the US. I'm sure most (more than 90%) just want a better life here in the US.

That said, I don't want them here unless they come through legal channels.

Ryan Elliott
07-14-2010, 10:47 PM
These will be the defenders of our nation.

http://epistemysics.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/kkk.jpg


That is one FABULOUS bedazzled crucifix.

artimoff
07-14-2010, 10:48 PM
So I have to go carrying my passport and birth certificate everywhere I go now? That's convenient.

You carry a wallet, don't you?

I was born here & I carry around my birth certificate every where I go.

Slewo.O
07-14-2010, 10:50 PM
That is one FABULOUS bedazzled crucifix.

The Klan has great taste in decorative crosses. Just look at this one.

http://rachelchitra.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/ku_klux_klan.png

Ryan Elliott
07-14-2010, 10:53 PM
The Klan has great taste in decorative crosses. Just look at this one.

http://rachelchitra.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/ku_klux_klan.png


Nothing like a nice warm fire to brighten the soul.

Slewo.O
07-14-2010, 10:57 PM
Nothing like a nice warm fire to brighten the soul.

They're good people aren't they? Good thing they're teaching our children.

artimoff
07-14-2010, 10:58 PM
The Klan has great taste in decorative crosses. Just look at this one.

http://rachelchitra.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/ku_klux_klan.png


Hey! I see Robert Bird (D) West Virginia.

Ryan Elliott
07-14-2010, 11:00 PM
Hey! I see Robert Bird (D) West Virginia.


Haha, he's dead!

Slewo.O
07-14-2010, 11:01 PM
Haha, he's dead!

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/40/754758-blackest_nightad_super.jpg

DEEZ
07-14-2010, 11:24 PM
The biggest legal problem with laws like Arizona's is that it will, inevitably, result in U.S. citizens being harassed and detained, because of some problem in ascertaining their citizenship status (ie. they aren't carrying ID, gaps in whatever database the cops are using to check, etc.). Of course, the citizen(s) will be of Hispanic heritage, but that's irrelevant to the constitutional issue. Once a citizen or two has cause of action, it should be easy to overturn the law.

It would be easy to fix the law, too. Just pass a state law making it SOP to check a every person's citizenship once they've already been arrested for an unrelated crime.

My biggest problem with the Mexican-scare that's running through America right now is that, like, it was their country first. California, Texas, etc., were "theirs" for at looooot longer than they've been U.S. territory. So, okay, we conquered fair and square (in arguendo), but the Treaty of Guadeloupe also nationalized every inhabitant of the territories, regardless of heritage. IT'S NOT AMERICAN LAND!

"And everybody talkin' 'bout: the South's taking over/It's true motherfucker - but it's comin' over the border!"

bachman
07-15-2010, 05:10 AM
Yeah! This is bullshit. It's like, when I get pulled over, I need to show my license, registration, and proof of insurance! 3 things! I thought this was America!!!

MIKE D
07-15-2010, 05:13 AM
Yeah! This is bullshit. It's like, when I get pulled over, I need to show my license, registration, and proof of insurance! 3 things! I thought this was America!!!

Would you be OK with it if you were expected to produce your birth certificate as well?

Ben
07-15-2010, 05:21 AM
You carry a wallet, don't you?

I was born here & I carry around my birth certificate every where I go.
That's crazy.

Marcdachamp
07-15-2010, 05:22 AM
Yeah! This is bullshit. It's like, when I get pulled over, I need to show my license, registration, and proof of insurance! 3 things! I thought this was America!!!

Pretend for a second this isn't racist.

It's sad that the second a democrat got into the white house these nutjobs sprang up in greater numbers.

BriRedfern
07-15-2010, 05:23 AM
Pretend for a second this isn't racist.

It's sad that the second a democrat got into the white house these nutjobs sprang up in greater numbers.

What does this mean? I don't necessarily disagree, I just don't understand what you are saying.

Ben
07-15-2010, 05:24 AM
Yeah! This is bullshit. It's like, when I get pulled over, I need to show my license, registration, and proof of insurance! 3 things! I thought this was America!!!You get pulled over because you're suspected of or observed committing a crime while operating a motor vehicle. Please tell me what this has to do with your status as a citizen.

BriRedfern
07-15-2010, 05:25 AM
That's crazy.

Its not crazy. He is just trying to make it easier for pick pockets to steal his identity. You're getting all up in his shit and all he is doing is trying to help out a neglected portion of our population. You are a bad person.

Treacle
07-15-2010, 05:27 AM
You carry a wallet, don't you?

I was born here & I carry around my birth certificate every where I go.

Good luck if your wallet gets stolen.

Treacle
07-15-2010, 05:29 AM
Yeah! This is bullshit. It's like, when I get pulled over, I need to show my license, registration, and proof of insurance! 3 things! I thought this was America!!!

That has absolutely nothing to do with what we're talking about here and you know it.

bachman
07-15-2010, 05:40 AM
You get pulled over because you're suspected of or observed committing a crime while operating a motor vehicle. Please tell me what this has to do with your status as a citizen.

When you are suspected of committing any crime, motor vehicle or not, you are expected to show a valid form of ID. And yes, depending on what kind of ID you have, and if it is current or not, there is nothing unreasonable about asking for a secondary piece of ID. Banks do it, countries all over the world do it...

This is not just a case of randomly asking brown people for "their papers".

CougarTrace
07-15-2010, 05:42 AM
You get pulled over because you're suspected of or observed committing a crime while operating a motor vehicle. Please tell me what this has to do with your status as a citizen.

well it does say that they only have to prove citizenship when pulled over for a violation. So, it would the same for anyone who has to prove everything with documents no matter the color.

Now, if you are saying that they will pick and choose who to pull over because of this, well thats a different matter.

But, expect alot of states to start doing this because its become a States right thing since the Federal govt has ignored the issue for so long.

Marcdachamp
07-15-2010, 06:00 AM
What does this mean? I don't necessarily disagree, I just don't understand what you are saying.

What I'm saying is that in the last 2 years, I've seen racism become more and more casual. People I never heard utter anything remotely racist now drop the "N" word like it's the '50's. Now, on top of that, you have this random xenophobia that you heard nothing of during the 8 years of the Bush administration.

Look, I'm not saying that Republicans are racist, or anything as general as that, but what I am saying is that NUTJOBS like this started becoming a little too vocal the second we got a president that just so happens to be black. And instead of smacking them down and pointing our fingers at them and saying "Bad!", we encourage it! We give them airtime, and press and consider their opinions like they should count. They shouldn't.

We're gonna make people show us their papers at a traffic stop? That's not partisan. That's insane. As you pointed out, that's an insanely easy way to have your identity stolen. And do you think it's going to happen to everyone? Fuck no. Who do you think is going to go through this extra BS? Probably not you or me.

bachman
07-15-2010, 06:02 AM
What I'm saying is that in the last 2 years, I've seen racism become more and more casual. People I never heard utter anything remotely racist now drop the "N" word like it's the '50's.

Well, that's sick, and it's an entirely different discussion and issue.

Marcdachamp
07-15-2010, 06:06 AM
Well, that's sick, and it's an entirely different discussion and issue.

You and I both know that's not true.

BriRedfern
07-15-2010, 06:22 AM
What I'm saying is that in the last 2 years, I've seen racism become more and more casual. People I never heard utter anything remotely racist now drop the "N" word like it's the '50's. Now, on top of that, you have this random xenophobia that you heard nothing of during the 8 years of the Bush administration.

Look, I'm not saying that Republicans are racist, or anything as general as that, but what I am saying is that NUTJOBS like this started becoming a little too vocal the second we got a president that just so happens to be black. And instead of smacking them down and pointing our fingers at them and saying "Bad!", we encourage it! We give them airtime, and press and consider their opinions like they should count. They shouldn't.

We're gonna make people show us their papers at a traffic stop? That's not partisan. That's insane. As you pointed out, that's an insanely easy way to have your identity stolen. And do you think it's going to happen to everyone? Fuck no. Who do you think is going to go through this extra BS? Probably not you or me.

First, thanks for explaining.

I haven't noticed any rise in racist rhetoric directly correlated to the new pres. Certainly people who know me don't say even casually racist things around me because of my particular situation.

I can see why people don't like these laws and I can see why people approve. As a man married to a Columbian woman that looks as white as any european ever, I can tell you that the law is flawed if it counts on visual queues to be enacted. You can't tell if someone is an illegal immigrant based on the way they look.

If a police officer has probable cause to suspect someone is an illegal alien than they should have some way of bringing that line of questioning to a reasonable conclusion - whether that should involve INS or not, I don't know. The correlary to this issue, making illegals afraid to involve the police in situations that they should be involved in, really needs to be addressed in any law like this that gets passed. People in this country (legal or illegal) CAN NOT be afraid to call 911 when the need arises.

Marcdachamp
07-15-2010, 06:36 AM
People in this country (legal or illegal) CAN NOT be afraid to call 911 when the need arises.

Agreed 100%.

Ben
07-15-2010, 06:38 AM
well it does say that they only have to prove citizenship when pulled over for a violation. So, it would the same for anyone who has to prove everything with documents no matter the color.

Now, if you are saying that they will pick and choose who to pull over because of this, well thats a different matter.

But, expect alot of states to start doing this because its become a States right thing since the Federal govt has ignored the issue for so long.But again, what does my citizenship have to do with my traffic violation?

Tax fraud is a problem. How about next time you're pulled over, if you're married, you have to present your marriage license? Or maybe show your last five years worth of tax returns to prove you paid. If you didn't pay, present pay stubs showing you made less than the minimum required to file.

And I guess a counter argument is "When would citizenship be relevant to any crime?" I don't know. But this seems ridiculous.

Again, I could be stopped on foot by a police officer for committing some crime or just to be questioned and would often NOT be required to show ANY form of ID in many, many states. Not even if they arrested me! But now I'd have to have my birth certificate or passport on me?

Cth
07-15-2010, 06:40 AM
I don't see how you could get a driver's license without a social security card.

There were three states that didn't require it for years.

Coincidentally, they had the highest concentration of illegals being brought in by buses :D

Frozen Sooner
07-15-2010, 06:41 AM
But, expect alot of states to start doing this because its become a States right thing since the Federal govt has ignored the issue for so long.

Constitution fail.

Treacle
07-15-2010, 06:42 AM
There were three states that didn't require it for years.

Coincidentally, they had the highest concentration of illegals being brought in by buses :D

Source?

BriRedfern
07-15-2010, 06:43 AM
But again, what does my citizenship have to do with my traffic violation?

Tax fraud is a problem. How about next time you're pulled over, if you're married, you have to present your marriage license? Or maybe show your last five years worth of tax returns to prove you paid. If you didn't pay, present pay stubs showing you made less than the minimum required to file.

And I guess a counter argument is "When would citizenship be relevant to any crime?" I don't know. But this seems ridiculous.

Again, I could be stopped on foot by a police officer for committing some crime or just to be questioned and would often NOT be required to show ANY form of ID in many, many states. Not even if they arrested me! But now I'd have to have my birth certificate or passport on me?

If the person is stopped for some crime and has a bunch of materials with them that indicate they have been committing tax fraud (I don't what those materials would be) the police officer should look into that. Same with immigration. If a person's demeanor or particular situation in some way suggests that they are in the country illegally a police officer who sees this behavior should not have to ignore it.

I don't think there is an easy answer to this question that makes everyone happy. But there seldom is.

Ben
07-15-2010, 06:52 AM
If the person is stopped for some crime and has a bunch of materials with them that indicate they have been committing tax fraud (I don't what those materials would be) the police officer should look into that. Same with immigration. If a person's demeanor or particular situation in some way suggests that they are in the country illegally a police officer who sees this behavior should not have to ignore it.

I don't think there is an easy answer to this question that makes everyone happy. But there seldom is.That's true. And what you say makes sense. It just seems too vague.

MIKE D
07-15-2010, 06:58 AM
That's true. And what you say makes sense. It just seems too vague.

Exactly. There's nothing I can think of that a person could do with their demeanor in front of a cop that could suggest illegal status beyond conjecture. I mean, what's the barometer? They don't speak English? What does that actually prove in the moment?

BriRedfern
07-15-2010, 06:58 AM
That's true. And what you say makes sense. It just seems too vague.

Which is why no one wants me writing laws. :)

MIKE D
07-15-2010, 06:59 AM
Which is why no one wants me writing laws. :)

Unfortunately, based on the Arizona law, the policymakers seem to be in the same vague boat you are.

Stark Raving
07-15-2010, 07:00 AM
I wonder what would happen if someone who is in favor of the Arizona law (you know, a "Real 'Merican") were to be asked for their "documentation" by a police officer.
I'm betting their reaction would be epic.

BriRedfern
07-15-2010, 07:02 AM
Exactly. There's nothing I can think of that a person could do with their demeanor in front of a cop that could suggest illegal status beyond conjecture. I mean, what's the barometer? They don't speak English? What does that actually prove in the moment?

Cops base decisions on demeanor all the time when someone is "acting guilty" of something. I think they are trained in this? I have had my car searched for acting scetchy. And scetchy I was. Cops have to be able to use their judgement, it is an integral part of their job. Prooper checks and balances just need to be put in place.

Marcdachamp
07-15-2010, 07:02 AM
I wonder what would happen if someone who is in favor of the Arizona law (you know, a "Real 'Merican") were to be asked for their "documentation" by a police officer.
I'm betting their reaction would be epic.

Oh, you know it.

Cth
07-15-2010, 07:08 AM
Source?

It's been at least 6 years, but it was all over our local news at the time, so if you want to look for links, I'm not sure how many are going to be current.

I'd post other links, but I know how these threads go, the source gets trashed without discussing the issue.

There's been an unusually high number of drunk driving deaths in our area by illegals and politicians were going nuts trying to pass the Scott Gardner act as a result.

MIKE D
07-15-2010, 07:11 AM
I wonder what would happen if someone who is in favor of the Arizona law (you know, a "Real 'Merican") were to be asked for their "documentation" by a police officer.
I'm betting their reaction would be epic.

If it happens to a Mexican, it's OK. If it happens to an American, is a gross violation of their civil rights and a huge overstepping of the government on the freedoms of the individual. Luckily, this will never happen to anyone with the skin color needed to bring this infringement to the attention of the tea parties.

DEEZ
07-15-2010, 05:45 PM
Yeah! This is bullshit. It's like, when I get pulled over, I need to show my license, registration, and proof of insurance! 3 things! I thought this was America!!!

It's unconstitutional for the federal, state, or local guvmit to demand proof of citizenship (or, in most cases, personal id of any kind). Those three things pertain to driving laws, not constitutional rights.

Treacle
07-15-2010, 05:56 PM
It's been at least 6 years, but it was all over our local news at the time, so if you want to look for links, I'm not sure how many are going to be current.

I'd post other links, but I know how these threads go, the source gets trashed without discussing the issue.

There's been an unusually high number of drunk driving deaths in our area by illegals and politicians were going nuts trying to pass the Scott Gardner act as a result.

If you don't have any evidence to support that claim, it might as well be a bogus one.

Treacle
07-15-2010, 05:57 PM
Cops base decisions on demeanor all the time when someone is "acting guilty" of something. I think they are trained in this? I have had my car searched for acting scetchy. And scetchy I was. Cops have to be able to use their judgement, it is an integral part of their job. Prooper checks and balances just need to be put in place.

Cops also base decisions on people who they believe "look like" criminals, which is how you b.s. phenomena like racial profiling.

bachman
07-15-2010, 06:09 PM
If you don't have any evidence to support that claim, it might as well be a bogus one.

Yeah cth, you lying asshole :)

Treacle
07-15-2010, 06:13 PM
Yeah cth, you lying asshole :)

Not what I said.

But if you're going to make a statement like "The 3 states which didn't require social security cards for driver's license also had the greatest numbers of illegal immigrants being smuggled in by buses," you should have something to support that statement.

Don't tell you've never asked someone to back up their claims on the Benbo before, Bachman?

michealdark
07-15-2010, 06:30 PM
This laws are xenophobic. Look, I´m from Barcelona, and Spain had one ot the most xenophobic inmigration laws in the world (I´m ashamed of that, BTW) That kind of persecution to inmigrants (both illegals and legals) is just a way to ignore the real problems of the world (at least in Spain) Why? Blame the imigrants for crime (for instance) instead of look te actual problem (poverty)

Here in Spain, bulgarians, rumanians and morocaans are pursued because of that kind of laws. I hate that, because they´re honest and hard-working people

Thank you for that. I think people need to hear from people living in other nations with similiar laws just the kind of crap they can cause.


I don't blame a single illegal immigrant for wanting to come to the US. I'm sure most (more than 90%) just want a better life here in the US.

That said, I don't want them here unless they come through legal channels.

Aren't quite a few people decended from people that came to this country in the most illegal way possible (ie. the genocide of the native population in conquest)? Look, we're all illegal fucking immigrants! What the fuck is so hard to understand about that?


You carry a wallet, don't you?

I was born here & I carry around my birth certificate every where I go.

I've maybe seen my birth certificate and SS card 3 times in my whole life. I just memorized my SSN for use on job applications.

Joe Kalicki
07-15-2010, 06:35 PM
Aren't quite a few people decended from people that came to this country in the most illegal way possible (ie. the genocide of the native population in conquest)? Look, we're all illegal fucking immigrants! What the fuck is so hard to understand about that?


Because that hasn't been true since the country was founded?

Treacle
07-15-2010, 06:36 PM
Because that hasn't been true since the country was founded?

How do you mean?

Petey Parker
07-15-2010, 06:37 PM
You know what really aggravazes me? It's them immigants. They wants all the benefits of living in America, but they ain't even bother to learn theyselves the language.

Ryan Elliott
07-15-2010, 06:38 PM
You know what really aggravazes me? It's them immigants. They wants all the benefits of living in America, but they ain't even bother to learn theyselves the language.


Der takin' er jeeeeeerbs!!!!

Joe Kalicki
07-15-2010, 06:39 PM
How do you mean?

Because we have a country now with rules to follow to become a citizen, and most immigrants were legally admitted. We are, in fact, not all illegal immigrants.

michealdark
07-15-2010, 06:56 PM
Because we have a country now with rules to follow to become a citizen, and most immigrants were legally admitted. We are, in fact, not all illegal immigrants.

okay, I'll give you that, but I still feel that this anti-immigrant scare is people forgetting how this country came her to begin with. It's also a complete ignorance of the motto on the Statue of Liberty, one of our most beloved monument:

The New Colossus

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,

With conquering limbs astride from land to land;

Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand

A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame

Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name

Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand

Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command

The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.

"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she

With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,

Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,

The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.

Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,

I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Slewo.O
07-15-2010, 06:57 PM
okay, I'll give you that, but I still feel that this anti-immigrant scare is people forgetting how this country came her to begin with. It's also a complete ignorance of the motto on the Statue of Liberty, one of our most beloved monument:The New Colossus

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,

With conquering limbs astride from land to land;

Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand

A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame

Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name

Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand

Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command

The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.

"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she

With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,

Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,

The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.

Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,

I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Again when that was written we weren't talking about Mexicans or Asians, or Eastern Europeans!

Jason California
07-15-2010, 07:00 PM
The study by the Highway Safety Research Center at the University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill was based on information from law enforcement agencies. It states that 7.04 percent of Hispanic drivers involved in crashes in 2005 were intoxicated, compared with 4.87 percent of Native Americans, 2.82 percent of whites and 2.28 percent of blacks.
Hispanics "are more likely on average to be suspected of drinking in crashes that police officers investigate," research center database specialist Eric Rodgman said.
Cultural differences and limited knowledge of U.S. laws might be driving the trend, law enforcement officials and community leaders said. Efforts are being made to develop education programs in the wake of recent high-profile fatal crashes.

http://www.starnewsonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060622/NEWS/606220415/1004

I am guessing 2 of the 3 states cth was talking about were North Carolina and New Jersey
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45392

Joe Kalicki
07-15-2010, 07:02 PM
So Michael, you would prefer to just let everybody in indescriminately and undocumented?

michealdark
07-15-2010, 07:10 PM
Not really. In fact I'd probably build a 30 foot electrofied fence along the border. But I'm also for clearing everyone that's already here rather than waste millions, possibly billions, to try to track them down, arrest them, deport them, and figure out what to do with the broken families. and clear and easier path to citizenship for anyone that wants to come here legally.

I just think losing our past and how we as a nation got to where we are today in an ocean of blatant xenophobia does us no favors.

costello
07-15-2010, 07:14 PM
OK, so they put chips under the skin of dogs so we can track them if they're lost. Just do the same with every American. Put a chip in their hand, and once a year they have to go to something equivalent to the DMV, but for humans, where they get a picture that's put into a file. That way if they're ever pulled over, the police officer can scan them and their picture and id will be available over the cpu.

Problem solved.

artimoff
07-15-2010, 07:18 PM
The biggest legal problem with laws like Arizona's is that it will, inevitably, result in U.S. citizens being harassed and detained, because of some problem in ascertaining their citizenship status

Have you seen the movie "Born in east LA"? That Cheech & Chong were way ahead of their time.

Treacle
07-15-2010, 07:19 PM
http://www.starnewsonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060622/NEWS/606220415/1004

I am guessing 2 of the 3 states cth was talking about were North Carolina and New Jersey
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45392

Thanks for the links, Jason..

michealdark
07-15-2010, 07:21 PM
OK, so they put chips under the skin of dogs so we can track them if they're lost. Just do the same with every American. Put a chip in their hand, and once a year they have to go to something equivalent to the DMV, but for humans, where they get a picture that's put into a file. That way if they're ever pulled over, the police officer can scan them and their picture and id will be available over the cpu.

Problem solved.

We need something like this for missing person's cases or something. Like a little microchip GPS system.

BronxRonin
07-15-2010, 07:48 PM
Goddamn, he's stupid.

I think his supporters are worse...he's clearly catering to someone in the crowd.

Jason California
07-15-2010, 07:56 PM
We need something like this for missing person's cases or something. Like a little microchip GPS system.


I am going to give a big Fuck You to anyone that tries to put a tracking chip in me. Especially if you couch it in the idea that you are doing it to help me out.

michealdark
07-15-2010, 08:00 PM
Well, it does have a certain terror quality to it in that it does seem like it could be easily abused. Which is why it'll never happen. But I'm thinking about kidnapping cases and how easy it would be to solve them if you could just pinpoint that person in an instant.

It's a system that has a great deal of benefits to it, but is too Big Brother to ever be a viable option in this country.

costello
07-15-2010, 08:01 PM
I am going to give a big Fuck You to anyone that tries to put a tracking chip in me. Especially if you couch it in the idea that you are doing it to help me out.

But if you're innocent, you have nothing to hide. What's the problem?

I'm not serious, and I hate that argument.

frzamonkey
07-15-2010, 08:07 PM
OK, so they put chips under the skin of dogs so we can track them if they're lost. Just do the same with every American. Put a chip in their hand, and once a year they have to go to something equivalent to the DMV, but for humans, where they get a picture that's put into a file. That way if they're ever pulled over, the police officer can scan them and their picture and id will be available over the cpu.

Problem solved.


suggesting your idea to the people who most adamantly support the arizona laws would make said people think of this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_of_the_beast).

my mom wont use gps because of this. seriously.