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Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 06:57 AM
I'm convinced the thing strapped to Keame's arm is a GPS tracker with a direct link to a Widmore satallite.

Ben and Locke share the same mother.

Jonny Z
05-09-2008, 06:57 AM
could that "metronome" device on Kearny maybe be something to ward off Smokey?

Cth
05-09-2008, 06:58 AM
Ahh, ok.. the reason I ask is because of that theory that was posted in the other thread.

I hadn't heard of "moving the island" talk until then, and suddenly Locke's talking about moving the island.

The timing seemed weird. One of the theories about who was alive and dead was the color of the shoes.

Jonny Z
05-09-2008, 06:59 AM
I'm convinced the thing strapped to Keame's arm is a GPS tracker with a direct link to a Widmore satallite.

Ben and Locke share the same mother.

Ben's mother died.

Patton
05-09-2008, 07:00 AM
I'm convinced the thing strapped to Keame's arm is a GPS tracker with a direct link to a Widmore satallite.

Ben and Locke share the same mother.

It definitely LOOKS like metronomes I've seen/used, albeit fancy ones. But I don 't know why he'd strap it to his arm so I don't know if I buy it being one. Those Lostapedia guys are crazy sometimes.

Think so? Well she does have the power to listen to a Buddy Holly record a year before it's release so she is special.

She can't seem to keep kids in her for the full 9 months though. Quitter.

Patton
05-09-2008, 07:02 AM
could that "metronome" device on Kearny maybe be something to ward off Smokey?

Could be. That or something to help against the time side effects. If he was looking in the book with the logo from Ben's episode maybe he's gonna time and/or space travel.

Patton
05-09-2008, 07:03 AM
Ben's mother died.

But not before giving birth to Locke and Jack.

Basically Lost is an update of Swiss Family Robinson.

greg donovan
05-09-2008, 07:04 AM
Ben's mother died.

and locke is older than ben...


i think it is just the same first name.

greg donovan
05-09-2008, 07:06 AM
maybe the device is some sort of deadman switch that will blow up something?

i am pretty sure alpert is immortal because of the comment ben made about alpert remembering birthdays.

Mister Mets
05-09-2008, 07:09 AM
Claire's a Skrull?!?

But that was a good episode. I hope Claire has a good explanation of why she left Aaron after three years of constant "WHERE'S MY BABY? I NEED MY BABY!"

And is the "Richard Alpert was on the Black Rock when it shipwrecked and now he's immortal" thing for real, or just a theory like everything else on this show?Her father appearing was probably the one thing that could have led Claire to abandon her kid (especially if he said something interesting).

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:09 AM
But not before giving birth to Locke and Jack.

Basically Lost is an update of Swiss Family Robinson.

Jack? What? Margo Shephard gave birth to Jack.

It's in direct dichotomy to two other players:

Ben and Locke - Same mother

Claire and Jack - Same father

Simple enough, right?

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:11 AM
and locke is older than ben...


i think it is just the same first name.

Exactly.

Maybe it's me making connections that aren't there, but that's the first thing I thought when I saw Emily.

Patton
05-09-2008, 07:14 AM
Jack? What? Margo Shephard gave birth to Jack.

It's in direct dichotomy to two other players:

Ben and Locke - Same mother

Claire and Jack - Same father

Simple enough, right?

I was uh...joking.

Really, really clearly joking.

I thought you were too.

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:15 AM
I was uh...joking.

Really, really clearly joking.

I thought you were too.

No way. The more I think about it, the more sense it makes actually.

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:16 AM
Hey, this theory's a lot more feasable than all this "Heaven/Hell" nonsense and the nanite bullshit people wouldn't give up for years.

Jonny Z
05-09-2008, 07:17 AM
Guys, Locke's mother showed up in the 90s.

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Emily_Annabeth_Locke

Mikhail
05-09-2008, 07:18 AM
Well....Locke's mother found him working in a toy store and helped anthony cooper con locke into giving him his kidney LONG after Ben's mother died giving birth to him, so....sorry to burst that bubble! :)

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:18 AM
Guys, Locke's mother showed up in the 90s.

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Emily_Annabeth_Locke

See, I thought she was a fake, though.

Wasn't she?

I must be confused somewhere.

Patton
05-09-2008, 07:19 AM
Guys, Locke's mother showed up in the 90s.

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Emily_Annabeth_Locke

No guys. Just one guy, I think.

BUT to be fair to Adrian...that woman probably might not be same woman from last night. Because she's not 20 years younger or whatever than Locke's dad.

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:20 AM
No guys. Just one guy, I think.

BUT to be fair to Adrian...that woman probably might not be same woman from last night. Because she's not 20 years younger or whatever than Locke's dad.

See, I can't remember that ep...I need to go back and watch, because I thought she wasn't really his mother, just someone hired by his father to get the kidney as part of the con.

It was a legitimate flub on my part.

Patton
05-09-2008, 07:21 AM
Hey, this theory's a lot more feasable than all this "Heaven/Hell" nonsense and the nanite bullshit people wouldn't give up for years.

That's for true.


See, I thought she was a fake, though.

Wasn't she?

I must be confused somewhere.

I don't remember either. But I do wonder why they cast an actress the same age as the actor who plays he dad if they were then gonna claim he was twice her age. I think there's definitely something we're missing there.

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:25 AM
Anyways, Locke choosing the knife instead the book of laws seemed to scare Richard more than anything. Why was that? Is is because Locke was the perfect fit for something more than the test Alpert was subjecting him to?

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 07:29 AM
As well, if Richard was feeling such fear of Locke, it would also explain why Abaddon would want to get Locke to the island as soon as he can.

bstie1198
05-09-2008, 07:29 AM
Anyways, Locke choosing the knife instead the book of laws seemed to scare Richard more than anything. Why was that? Is is because Locke was the perfect fit for something more than the test Alpert was subjecting him to?

I think the vial had sand from the island, and John was supposed to take it, because the island is "his".

Yannick_B
05-09-2008, 07:31 AM
Anyways, Locke choosing the knife instead the book of laws seemed to scare Richard more than anything. Why was that? Is is because Locke was the perfect fit for something more than the test Alpert was subjecting him to?

John Locke's supposed to be a farmer, not a hunter.

Evan Wiener
05-09-2008, 07:42 AM
As well, if Richard was feeling such fear of Locke, it would also explain why Abaddon would want to get Locke to the island as soon as he can.

That makes a lot of sense. He's their tool, and a "false" prophet. Neat.

Patton
05-09-2008, 07:45 AM
He did seem to smile when Locke picked up the sand.

Maybe he was mad that Locke chose what he wanted instead of listening to his instincts or something to that effect.

bstie1198
05-09-2008, 07:59 AM
As well, if Richard was feeling such fear of Locke, it would also explain why Abaddon would want to get Locke to the island as soon as he can.

But he went after him again in high school (science camp), so I don't buy it that the little kid encounter scared him off.

Adrian B AWESOME
05-09-2008, 08:00 AM
But he went after him again in high school (science camp), so I don't buy it that the little kid encounter scared him off.

Not really. The science teacher suggested it. If he had really wanted him, Alpert would've gone himself.

Patton
05-09-2008, 08:04 AM
Not really. The science teacher suggested it. If he had really wanted him, Alpert would've gone himself.

Maybe not. He wouldn't want Locke to see him and remember that he hasn't aged a day.

Wait...he's in the picture the guy shows him isn't he? Well nevermind on that then.

Dark Sasha
05-09-2008, 08:04 AM
But he went after him again in high school (science camp), so I don't buy it that the little kid encounter scared him off.


Not really. The science teacher suggested it. If he had really wanted him, Alpert would've gone himself.
Remember Richard said he "wasn't ready yet" when he met him as a child.

bstie1198
05-09-2008, 08:07 AM
Not really. The science teacher suggested it. If he had really wanted him, Alpert would've gone himself.

The science teacher said he got a call about John from someone in Portland Richard Alpert urging him to go to the camp, and John even asked how they knew about him, so it's not like the science teacher made this up on his own. I think it's more likely that he didn't want John to remember him from 10+ years earlier.

Lab-Rat
05-09-2008, 08:09 AM
I didn't take it as Richard being scared of Locke when he choose the knife. I took it as Richard was pissed off at Locke for choosing the wrong item.

See...I got the impression that from Richard's point of view...Lock was supposed to be their Leader. However...in Locke's mind...he's a hunter, not a leader (yes I know he's a child...but him choosing the knife shows that he in some way thought he was a hunter). You can put this up to his fucked up childhood being in foster care and all that shit...it screwed him up and therefore he moved away from what his destiny was supposed to be. Since he went down the wrong path...the island chose someone else to lead. They chose Ben. Hell..Ben probably has more similarities with Locke other than their mother's first name, being born premature, and having to kill their fathers. Ben became the interim leader until Locke finally made his way to the island.

When Locke did come to the island, they knew he was ready. When he killed his father (or at least...had Sawyer kill his father), which was his last tie to his life off the island....the last thing that was holding him back mentally, he finally started down the road he should have been going down a long time ago.

Now he's taken charge.


I find this change in Ben to be very interesting. It also explains when he is killing off all of Widmore's people. He's not playing the supposed game that Widmore and him had been playing previously. Why? He's not in charge. The game is over....and Widmore doesn't know it yet. Ben knows that Locke will protect the island. Ben, so he can have some control over something seems to have decided to take matters into his own hands to protect the island in a preemptive fashion off the island.



Also I loved the scene between Hurley and Ben with the candy bar. Hurley seems to have a moment like that with everyone on the show...and it just goes to show why his character is so awesome. :)

Gregory
05-09-2008, 08:13 AM
Also I loved the scene between Hurley and Ben with the candy bar. Hurley seems to have a moment like that with everyone on the show...and it just goes to show why his character is so awesome. :)

Didn't Ben eat Apollo Bars as a kid? That's what Hurley would have found in the Dharma stores.

djcoffman
05-09-2008, 08:13 AM
I've been thinking for a while that-- the island has been hidden in some way and only people who are "chosen" go there-- and they sort of followed Locke there somehow-- maybe they implanted tracker in him when they were removing his kidney?

But I'm talking them knowing he was going to ultimately end up on the island they've been looking for-- so they've been tracking him not just across time, but time / space. -- if you can wrap your brain around that.

Lab-Rat
05-09-2008, 08:17 AM
I've been thinking for a while that-- the island has been hidden in some way and only people who are "chosen" go there-- and they sort of followed Locke there somehow-- maybe they implanted tracker in him when they were removing his kidney?

But I'm talking them knowing he was going to ultimately end up on the island they've been looking for-- so they've been tracking him not just across time, but time / space. -- if you can wrap your brain around that.

hmm...I can see where you are going with this...and it's a good possibility. The Widmore group knew Locke was supposed to go to the island somehow. They knew Locke had been steered off the path that destiny was supposed to take him. So...they decided to nudge him in the right direction to get him on track to meeting his destiny...then they just sat back and watched him until he could lead them to the island.

Bradford
05-09-2008, 01:55 PM
Did anyone else notice that we now know how the Oceanic 6 get off the island?

And why there's only 6?

ZODIAC

Patton
05-09-2008, 02:17 PM
Good Damon and Carlton interview:

http://www.eonline.com/gossip/kristin/detail/index.jsp?uuid=30ea40d8-c950-4ae6-af8e-3c7cd60d6384

But if you want complete freshness on the finale don't read it because I think I was able to extrapolate one of the season finale surprises. Maybe.

Bradford
05-09-2008, 02:34 PM
<broken record>Still reeling from the Claire sucker-punch.....</broken record>

JoeE
05-09-2008, 02:42 PM
Just watched...awesome episode. How great was that Matthew Abaddon reveal?

I'm glad at least some of The Wire actors have been able to find work that's on their level now that the show is over.

Patton
05-09-2008, 02:59 PM
Just watched...awesome episode. How great was that Matthew Abaddon reveal?

I'm glad at least some of The Wire actors have been able to find work that's on their level now that the show is over.

Just fyi in case you didn't know: Amy Ryan will be on the Office season finale next week.

Len Snark
05-09-2008, 04:35 PM
I like reading this thread after I watch an episode. Lots of interesting theories, albeit probably a lot of wrong ones.

Anyway, my personal theory (also probably wrong) is that Bat Manuel traveled back in time once Locke was already on the island. I could be wrong, but wasn't Richard given the job of finding out everything about the people on the plane when Ben saw it was crashing? If so, there's probably no better way to do that than a little time travel and I figure that's what the temple is for. Probably some sort of nexus that allows them to go back/forth in time. Richard's messenger bag looked a bit modern for the past, in my opinion. Anyway, I figure Richard went back in time, found something out about Locke, and then tried to ascertain whether or not it would have been useful by visiting him at birth and at a young age (where he tested him). Maybe he was turned off by the knife because he was "supposed" to choose the "Book of Laws", making him the leader. The knife might have indicated that Locke was a threat or something like that, which Richard took as his cue to leave the house (and the past) to return with the 411 for Ben.

And if Claire isn't dead, she's severely medicated or something.

The Human Target
05-09-2008, 05:12 PM
Jack? What? Margo Shephard gave birth to Jack.

It's in direct dichotomy to two other players:

Ben and Locke - Same mother

Claire and Jack - Same father

Simple enough, right?

Uhhhh yeah.

Nanites are the dumb idea.

The Human Target
05-09-2008, 05:18 PM
She's now a mysterious, sneering, aloof "island-person." There was nothing human about her. Human Claire would have been freaked-the-hell-out in there. Sure, maybe she didn't "die" per se, but there's no way we're going to get normal Claire back. She's now part of the weirdness. I fully expect nothing but aloofness, mysterious looks, lines like "It's not your time yet" etc.

It's like when the aliens show up and want to take your girlfriend...and she rolls with it and gets on their ship. Stomach punch. Maybe she's not dead, but you're definitely never getting her back.

Yeah, I think Claire died of her injuries in her sleep.


I didn't take it as Richard being scared of Locke when he choose the knife. I took it as Richard was pissed off at Locke for choosing the wrong item.

See...I got the impression that from Richard's point of view...Lock was supposed to be their Leader. However...in Locke's mind...he's a hunter, not a leader (yes I know he's a child...but him choosing the knife shows that he in some way thought he was a hunter). You can put this up to his fucked up childhood being in foster care and all that shit...it screwed him up and therefore he moved away from what his destiny was supposed to be. Since he went down the wrong path...the island chose someone else to lead. They chose Ben. Hell..Ben probably has more similarities with Locke other than their mother's first name, being born premature, and having to kill their fathers. Ben became the interim leader until Locke finally made his way to the island.

When Locke did come to the island, they knew he was ready. When he killed his father (or at least...had Sawyer kill his father), which was his last tie to his life off the island....the last thing that was holding him back mentally, he finally started down the road he should have been going down a long time ago.

Now he's taken charge.

I find this change in Ben to be very interesting. It also explains when he is killing off all of Widmore's people. He's not playing the supposed game that Widmore and him had been playing previously. Why? He's not in charge. The game is over....and Widmore doesn't know it yet. Ben knows that Locke will protect the island. Ben, so he can have some control over something seems to have decided to take matters into his own hands to protect the island in a preemptive fashion off the island.

Also I loved the scene between Hurley and Ben with the candy bar. Hurley seems to have a moment like that with everyone on the show...and it just goes to show why his character is so awesome. :)

Agreed all around man.


So, I think now we know why the Oceanic 6 are the only ones who make it off the island. They take the first trip to the freighter (or wherever) and then Locke moves the island before anyone else can get rescued.

bachman
05-09-2008, 05:21 PM
Uhhhh yeah.

Nanites are the dumb idea.

Nanites are the AWESOME idea, you mean.

Everyone keeps making that mistake...

ForkDolphin
05-09-2008, 05:23 PM
I don't know if anyone has mentioned this but when Richard asked Locke to choose from the objects it seemed pretty clear that there is some sort of reincarnation/rebirth stuff going on here. The way he asked which objects belong to him already and all. Skimming through here I didn't seen anything and it was so blatant to me. Thoughts?

The Human Target
05-09-2008, 05:36 PM
Nanites are the AWESOME idea, you mean.

Everyone keeps making that mistake...

Fuck yeah it is.

It made the most sense all those many years ago with the information we had.

Now we have so much more information it does seem kinda silly, but I stand by it.

Patton
05-09-2008, 05:45 PM
I don't know if anyone has mentioned this but when Richard asked Locke to choose from the objects it seemed pretty clear that there is some sort of reincarnation/rebirth stuff going on here. The way he asked which objects belong to him already and all. Skimming through here I didn't seen anything and it was so blatant to me. Thoughts?

I think quite a few people mentioned that actually.

Bradford
05-09-2008, 08:07 PM
Also, now we know why there's a Pirate ship in the middle of the Island! It crashed on the shore...and as the Island has moved its location has shifted.

At some point the Island was probably in the arctic ----> Polar Bears

At another point, the Island was near Africa ---> Yemi's plane.

The Human Target
05-09-2008, 08:16 PM
Also, now we know why there's a Pirate ship in the middle of the Island! It crashed on the shore...and as the Island has moved its location has shifted.

At some point the Island was probably in the arctic ----> Polar Bears

At another point, the Island was near Africa ---> Yemi's plane.

The polar bear thing has already been answered many a time. The DHARMA peeps brought them to the island to experiment on. They were caged in the same place Sawyer and Kate were (and where they made sexy filthy love.)


Plus the idea that the island moves, but the things on the island don't is awkward. Why would the Black Rock shift around but the trees and buildings and whatnot stay in the same location?

Brandon Reynolds
05-09-2008, 08:17 PM
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2159/2477586920_6322791dd8.jpg

?

My guess is that is a fail safe of sorts. If Keamy gets killed I'm guess that little monitor will set off some bombs or poison gas. Remember Keamy tells the Captain that's it's not a good idea to point a gun at him.

Briomega
05-09-2008, 08:33 PM
My guess is that is a fail safe of sorts. If Keamy gets killed I'm guess that little monitor will set off some bombs or poison gas. Remember Keamy tells the Captain that's it's not a good idea to point a gun at him.

Yeah, I'm thinking it destroys the ship so that if he happens to get killed it makes sure nobody escapes the island.

The Count
05-09-2008, 08:46 PM
Also, now we know why there's a Pirate ship in the middle of the Island! It crashed on the shore...and as the Island has moved its location has shifted.

The Black Rock is in its position due to the fact that the island shifted itself or was shifted to a position surrounding the Black Rock during its voyage, causing the ship to become landlocked when the island re-emerged or reappeared. The Black Rock is in its current position due to an accident during the islands movement, or purposely to capture the ship and its crew. Speculation of course!

Dreaded Anomaly
05-09-2008, 08:55 PM
I liked seeing young Locke playing backgammon. The Richard and Abaddon appearances were great, and my family was a bit surprised that I remembered Abaddon's name, not knowing that I spend hours of my life each week in these threads. :D

Claire's appearance in the cabin was both creepy and awesome at the same time. I don't think it necessary implies that she's dead, either; isn't the jury still out on whether or not Christian is dead in the future?

It seems like this episode introduced a lot of shadiness into the truth behind Locke's family. If he was in foster care for most of his childhood, how would he know if the Emily who conned him into giving his father his kidney was really his mother? Emily Linus and Christian are two dead parents who have appeared post-mortem on the Island, so I don't think we can discount Adrian's theory just yet.

More trivia from Lostpedia:
The actress who plays Emily Linus, Carrie Preston, is married to Michael Emerson, who plays Ben.
Richard's company, Mittelos Bioscience, has tried to recruit both Juliet and Locke. Mittelos is an anagram of "lost time."

Cth
05-12-2008, 05:53 AM
Good Damon and Carlton interview:

http://www.eonline.com/gossip/kristin/detail/index.jsp?uuid=30ea40d8-c950-4ae6-af8e-3c7cd60d6384

But if you want complete freshness on the finale don't read it because I think I was able to extrapolate one of the season finale surprises. Maybe.

Can you post or PM your thoughts?

Patton
05-12-2008, 06:13 AM
Can you post or PM your thoughts?

It's nothing huge but

When they said this:


Do you see Penny and Desmond as a central plot for the show? And if Penny were to die would Desmond die because she's his Constant? Is that a fair assumption?
D.L.: Desmond and Penny are an incredibly important part of the show, and one of our favorite romances and relationship to write on the show. Obviously, Sonya Walger is an incredibly busy actor, and as a result of that, it limits our ability to go to the Penny and Desmond well, but every time we do, it's very special as something that we do not get to explore every other week. All we can say is that there's a lot more to tell about that story, but hopefully you will have a better sense of that over the summer.


And coupled with the "spectacular kiss" they've been teasing makes it seem like Penny shows up on the island or at the freighter.

I could be wrong though.

Cth
05-12-2008, 06:16 AM
Ahh ok. Thanks!

Cth
05-12-2008, 06:35 AM
Did anyone else notice that we now know how the Oceanic 6 get off the island?

And why there's only 6?

ZODIAC

Very nice catch!

Sayid
Jack (he's in need of medical assistance)
Sun (pregnant)
Kate (to watch over Jack)
Aaron (?)
Hurley (?)

Although I saw someone mention that the six could be those who were away from the island/purple light when the hatch exploded.

I'm guessing Locke moving the island prevents them from going back to get the rest and why he's so upset about not being able to find his way back.

Maybe the "twist" is that there's no more island? Or that they can't find it anymore?

Patton
05-12-2008, 06:42 AM
Very nice catch!

Sayid
Jack (he's in need of medical assistance)
Sun (pregnant)
Kate (to watch over Jack)
Aaron (?)
Hurley (?)


Here's how I see it:

Sayid - Some sort of talent manning the vessel?
Jack - In need of medical assistance
Sun - Pregnant
Kate - To watch over Aaron
Aaron - He's a baby
Hurley - He's eating too much of their food supply

nihilance
05-12-2008, 06:44 AM
Where is Ben going to head that could protect him from the mercs? The Temple? Another station (if the Temple is not in fact a station)? The sphincter of the tutrle island?

My guess is that Ben is fleeing the mercs...and is even shot (grazing his arm) as he dons a parka and activates the machine that sent the polar bear to the desert. He probably didn't have time to set the machine properly...or assumed that it was projecting to a cold environment if he knew the last time it was used was for a polar bear (hence the parka). So when he escapes using in this fashion he then appears in the Tunisian desert from his flashforward episode. The escape was through dialated time, which is why he was both curious about the year and surprised to see the developments with Sayid on the television. This is also why Sayid is also surprised to see Ben...as it's been months since the Oceanic 6 left the island. He assumes that Ben has left during this gap...when in fact they probably left about the same time but Ben lost time due to his method of escape.

Cth
05-12-2008, 06:50 AM
Hrm, could the Orchid be the Temple?

And the Temple is the key to everything.

Like say, moving the island through space AND time. Which might be why it's so hard to find the island?

And if they can move through time, that makes the flashforward/back stuff disappear, making it a game changer.

Maybe the button sequence is to keep the island in sync with time, but now that the hatch blew up, it's slowly drifting out of sync with the rest of the world?

Maybe the people present at the temple get dumped around the world like Ben did? They'd be "LOST" and maybe that's how the Oceanic Six story falls apart?

nihilance
05-12-2008, 06:51 AM
Here's how I see it:

Sayid - Some sort of talent manning the vessel?
Jack - In need of medical assistance
Sun - Pregnant
Kate - To watch over Aaron
Aaron - He's a baby
Hurley - He's eating too much of their food supply

The interesting thing is that the O6 are basically split into 4 separate groups at the moment (Sayid on Zodiac, Jack/Sun/Kate on beach, Aaron w/Sawyer & Miles in jungle, Hurley w/Ben & Locke @ cabin)...and something will bring them all together in order for them to leave the island. Part of it may well be Jack and crew following the tracker thrown from the coptor by Lapidus. They will no doubt encounter Sawyer and crew since they are coming to the beach anyway. But Hurley is no where close...and you would assume Sayid would take the zodiac to the beach...it will be interesting to see how all the threads dovetail in these final three hours.

nihilance
05-12-2008, 06:55 AM
Maybe the button sequence is to keep the island in sync with time, but now that the hatch blew up, it's slowly drifting out of sync with the rest of the world?

Perhaps the "failsafe" that Desmond activated was a way to "anchor" the island more permanantly in time and space. It might be that Locke and crew need to reverse the failsafe in some way to shift the island once again.

nick maynard
05-12-2008, 07:05 AM
lindelof dropped some knowledge on the last podcast.

he said something like, the angle you approach the island affects the time displacement. so, maybe those dharma food drops are being made by planes flying during the 60's, hitting the right angle, coming forward in time, dropping the food every 6 months or whatev, then flying out at the right angle and getting back to the 60's.

Cth
05-12-2008, 07:10 AM
It might be worth checking the thread discussion for THE CONSTANT since a lot of space-time stuff was posted that might make more sense now in retrospect.

nihilance
05-12-2008, 07:14 AM
lindelof dropped some knowledge on the last podcast.

he said something like, the angle you approach the island affects the time displacement. so, maybe those dharma food drops are being made by planes flying during the 60's, hitting the right angle, coming forward in time, dropping the food every 6 months or whatev, then flying out at the right angle and getting back to the 60's.

Ranch Dressing that didn't require constant refrigeration wasn't created until 1983. Course maybe Dharma had spies in the Hidden Valley Ranch during the 60's and stole the original recipe to develop their own non-refrigerated version using nanite technology years earlier.

nick maynard
05-12-2008, 07:15 AM
Ranch Dressing that didn't require constant refrigeration wasn't created until 1983. Course maybe Dharma had spies in the Hidden Valley Ranch during the 60's and stole the original recipe to develop their own non-refrigerated version using nanite technology years earlier.
well, they're time traveling so maybe they figured out the ranch dressing thing too.

mkecub
05-12-2008, 07:20 AM
Perhaps the "failsafe" that Desmond activated was a way to "anchor" the island more permanantly in time and space. It might be that Locke and crew need to reverse the failsafe in some way to shift the island once again.

Good thought, but lets say that Widmore controls or is heavily involved with the Dharma people. Dharma created the button and failsafe. If they had wanted to "anchor" the island, then wouldn't they have just activated the failsafe 30-40 years ago?

Cth
05-12-2008, 07:33 AM
Found it:
http://www.606studios.com/bendisboard/showpost.php?p=4336975&postcount=222

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/27/Light_cone.svg/180px-Light_cone.svg.png



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorentz_transformation

In physics, the Lorentz transformation is a set of equations that converts between two different observers' measurements of space and time, where one observer is in constant motion with respect to the other. In classical physics (Galilean relativity), the only conversion believed necessary was x' = x ? vt, describing how the origin of one observer's coordinate system slides through space with respect to the other's, at speed v and along the x-axis of each frame. According to special relativity, this is only a good approximation at speeds small compared to the speed of light, and in general the result is not just an offsetting of the x coordinates; lengths and times are distorted as well.

If space is homogeneous, then the Lorentz transformation must be a linear transformation. Also, since relativity postulates that the speed of light is the same for all observers, it must preserve the spacetime interval between any two events in Minkowski space. The Lorentz transformations describe only the transformations in which the event at x=0, t=0 is left fixed, so they can be considered as a rotation of Minkowski space. The more general set of transformations that also includes translations is known as the Poincaré group.

Henri Poincaré (1905) named the Lorentz transformations after the Dutch physicist and mathematician Hendrik Lorentz (1853-192. They form the mathematical basis for Albert Einstein's theory of special relativity. The Lorentz transformations remove contradictions between the theories of electromagnetism and classical mechanics. They were derived by Joseph Larmor (1897) and Lorentz (1899, 1904). In 1905 Einstein derived them under the assumptions of Lorentz covariance and the constancy of the speed of light in any inertial reference frame.


Moving the island?

Nick_Ardill
05-12-2008, 07:56 AM
I didn't read the whole thread but any guess that Locke is the reincarnation of Hanso? Just a random idea.

frzamonkey
05-12-2008, 09:37 PM
i know it's a silly question, but have we seen them eating the ranch dressing? and if so, was it in a bottle? i would assume it would be some sort of add water powder situation.

Nick Spencer
05-12-2008, 09:41 PM
well, they're time traveling so maybe they figured out the ranch dressing thing too.

:lol:

nihilance
05-13-2008, 04:26 AM
i know it's a silly question, but have we seen them eating the ranch dressing? and if so, was it in a bottle? i would assume it would be some sort of add water powder situation.

Yeah...we've seen Hurley helping himself a couple times. It is in regular liquid form in a giant plastic jar container like you see at Sam's Club.

Although I brought it up (semi-jokingly), we probably shouldn't get hung up on it...no doubt a minor flub, like when Walt told his dad he needed new batteries for his Gameboy SP at the airport.

Patton
05-13-2008, 05:21 AM
Yeah...we've seen Hurley helping himself a couple times. It is in regular liquid form in a giant plastic jar container like you see at Sam's Club.

Although I brought it up (semi-jokingly), we probably shouldn't get hung up on it...no doubt a minor flub, like when Walt told his dad he needed new batteries for his Gameboy SP at the airport.

What's the problem there? They don't use traditional batteries? I never had one.

Cth
05-13-2008, 05:59 AM
Apparently they don't. Something about a rechargable lithium ion battery.

Of course, someone says it's intentional by the writers to show that Walt was listening to his dad and counting on him not knowing about the battery thing.

Cth
05-29-2008, 07:10 AM
Here's a reallllllllllly crazy theory someone posted..

It's about Charlotte.

It's very unlikely, but they raise some interesting points. Specifically the water stuff.

MINOR SPOILER FOR TONIGHT'S FINALE HIDDEN

A coincidence rarely seems to be just that on Lost, and I doubt the writers decided to have two characters both named Charlotte, who also both happen to have red hair and eerie blue eyes. (I'd post images but my post count isn't high enough yet. Look on Lostpedia). It seems impossible that they could be the same person because (1) they have different names and different parents (Ben reveals Charlotte Lewis' parents to be David and Jeanette of Essex) and seemingly two totally unrelated lives, and (2) the ages, we don't have exacts but Charlotte Lewis looks at least a good 5 years older than Charlotte Malkin. But this is Lost, and I think there's a way that makes, uh, sense.

Charlotte Malkin is the daughter of Richard Malkin, and she supposedly drowned and came back to life after being catatonic in a river for a few hours. Richard Malkin, in case it doesn't ring a bell, is the psychic that tells Claire that she must keep her baby, and ends up arranging the flight that will strand her on the island. So right off the bat, his character should seem a little suspect now that we know that there are forces off the island who are still very much involved and connected with it. Mr. Eko investigates Charlotte's case for the Church (her mother believes she is a miracle) and Malkin admits to Eko that he is a fraud, not a psychic. Yet, he knew about Claire. So is he really a fraud and Claire was just so special that he somehow got a flash of something, or is he really a fraud and only "knows" about Claire because someone **coughBencough** told him what he should say to her? Anyway, that's a tangent, but important because I believe that Richard Malkin works for Ben or someone else in some capacity.

So, how could this be Charlotte Lewis? This answer involves Malkin and a potential relationship to the island, the time properties of the island, and the theory that some children are just born special. The incident that Eko goes to investigate regarding the drowned girl makes me believe that Charlotte Malkin and Charlotte Lewis are the same person, a very special girl.

We have learned that time travel or however you chose to label it is possible through consciousness leaps of some sort. Desmond does it, I believe Ben and Alpert and probably others (Faraday) can do it as well. In "The Constant" several of the scenes made it seem to me as if water was somehow important to the leaps (Donnie Darko, anyone?). Desmond leaps when he tries to get a coin from a puddle, he awakes another time in the rain, and Widmore (who knows more than he lets on) left the water running in the sink knowing Des would turn it off, jetisoning him back to his island-inhabiting body. We also learned by seeing Minkowski, that when your consciousness has jumped, your body remains alive while appearing quite dead (because it's an empty vessel at that point). I do not believe that Charlotte Malkin ever drowned and then magically came back to life. I think a young girl decided to play in a river, and woke up 2 hours later after having been "somewhere else", a somewhere else where she happened to meet Eko's brother Yemi, who we now know was dead on the island. While her consciousness was somewhere else, presumably on the island (sparking Charlotte Lewis' character's quest to find this place her mind had gone), her body appeared to be dead. Then her consciousness came back, and she awoke to tell Eko of meeting his brother while she was "between places." I think that Charlotte is a natural born jumper if you will, likely unable to understand or control her ability, which is why she chose the path of the explorer.

Many have already postulated that Charlotte Lewis would end up being a mole for Ben. I agree that their initial interaction was strange, as if they were trying to hard to be strangers. He shoots her in the chest rather than the head, and she happens to be wearing a bulletprof vest. It just seems a little off. So maybe they do know each other. Maybe Ben was interested in young Charlotte, like he is interested in Walt and probably Aaron. That being said, there is no guarantee that Charlotte from the freighter is actually named Charlotte Staples-Lewis, or that her parents are David and Jeanette of Essex. Ben could be lying (WHAT?!), putting on a little show for the Losties and maybe Charlotte herself depending on who she truly is working for. If she really is working for Widmore or Abbadon, perhaps Charlotte Lewis is a real alias of hers, which Ben gives her to show that he has connections to the outside world without giving away how much he really knows about her. Or, she could be working for Ben, and all the stuff about her life in England was lip service for Locke's benefit. Or, Richard Malkin could be who I said he was earlier, and he and his wife could be serving as surrogate parents for Charlotte, who perhaps was born on the island.

As far as the jump in her age, Walt seems like a good indicator of how that could be explained, although I won't even attempt to sound all sciency and stuff.

So long story short: Charlotte Lewis IS Charlotte Malkin, a girl with the ability to jump with her consciousness. After a traumatic experience with a river and a strange trip where she met Eko's dead brother, she became obsessed with figuring out her own abilities, as well as the magical place she visited while she was "dead" (the island) and the mysterious connection it all has to her, Eko, flight 815, etc. This would also explain her disbelief at the plane crash and her excitement at finding the now-defunct Dharma logo, if her consciousness was somehow able to jump between the regular world and the island. I see no reason to ignore the physical evidence (Charlotte Lewis looks like a grown up Charlotte Malkin) when this would make her a character that would embody so much of the mystery of Lost.

http://images.lostpedia.com/images/thumb/5/58/Charlotte_malkin.jpg/250px-Charlotte_malkin.jpg http://images.lostpedia.com/images/thumb/1/11/CharlotteS4.jpg/250px-CharlotteS4.jpg

Papa Ginge
05-29-2008, 07:29 AM
Here's a reallllllllllly crazy theory someone posted..

It's about Charlotte.

It's very unlikely, but they raise some interesting points. Specifically the water stuff.

MINOR SPOILER FOR TONIGHT'S FINALE HIDDEN

A coincidence rarely seems to be just that on Lost, and I doubt the writers decided to have two characters both named Charlotte, who also both happen to have red hair and eerie blue eyes. (I'd post images but my post count isn't high enough yet. Look on Lostpedia). It seems impossible that they could be the same person because (1) they have different names and different parents (Ben reveals Charlotte Lewis' parents to be David and Jeanette of Essex) and seemingly two totally unrelated lives, and (2) the ages, we don't have exacts but Charlotte Lewis looks at least a good 5 years older than Charlotte Malkin. But this is Lost, and I think there's a way that makes, uh, sense.

Charlotte Malkin is the daughter of Richard Malkin, and she supposedly drowned and came back to life after being catatonic in a river for a few hours. Richard Malkin, in case it doesn't ring a bell, is the psychic that tells Claire that she must keep her baby, and ends up arranging the flight that will strand her on the island. So right off the bat, his character should seem a little suspect now that we know that there are forces off the island who are still very much involved and connected with it. Mr. Eko investigates Charlotte's case for the Church (her mother believes she is a miracle) and Malkin admits to Eko that he is a fraud, not a psychic. Yet, he knew about Claire. So is he really a fraud and Claire was just so special that he somehow got a flash of something, or is he really a fraud and only "knows" about Claire because someone **coughBencough** told him what he should say to her? Anyway, that's a tangent, but important because I believe that Richard Malkin works for Ben or someone else in some capacity.

So, how could this be Charlotte Lewis? This answer involves Malkin and a potential relationship to the island, the time properties of the island, and the theory that some children are just born special. The incident that Eko goes to investigate regarding the drowned girl makes me believe that Charlotte Malkin and Charlotte Lewis are the same person, a very special girl.

We have learned that time travel or however you chose to label it is possible through consciousness leaps of some sort. Desmond does it, I believe Ben and Alpert and probably others (Faraday) can do it as well. In "The Constant" several of the scenes made it seem to me as if water was somehow important to the leaps (Donnie Darko, anyone?). Desmond leaps when he tries to get a coin from a puddle, he awakes another time in the rain, and Widmore (who knows more than he lets on) left the water running in the sink knowing Des would turn it off, jetisoning him back to his island-inhabiting body. We also learned by seeing Minkowski, that when your consciousness has jumped, your body remains alive while appearing quite dead (because it's an empty vessel at that point). I do not believe that Charlotte Malkin ever drowned and then magically came back to life. I think a young girl decided to play in a river, and woke up 2 hours later after having been "somewhere else", a somewhere else where she happened to meet Eko's brother Yemi, who we now know was dead on the island. While her consciousness was somewhere else, presumably on the island (sparking Charlotte Lewis' character's quest to find this place her mind had gone), her body appeared to be dead. Then her consciousness came back, and she awoke to tell Eko of meeting his brother while she was "between places." I think that Charlotte is a natural born jumper if you will, likely unable to understand or control her ability, which is why she chose the path of the explorer.

Many have already postulated that Charlotte Lewis would end up being a mole for Ben. I agree that their initial interaction was strange, as if they were trying to hard to be strangers. He shoots her in the chest rather than the head, and she happens to be wearing a bulletprof vest. It just seems a little off. So maybe they do know each other. Maybe Ben was interested in young Charlotte, like he is interested in Walt and probably Aaron. That being said, there is no guarantee that Charlotte from the freighter is actually named Charlotte Staples-Lewis, or that her parents are David and Jeanette of Essex. Ben could be lying (WHAT?!), putting on a little show for the Losties and maybe Charlotte herself depending on who she truly is working for. If she really is working for Widmore or Abbadon, perhaps Charlotte Lewis is a real alias of hers, which Ben gives her to show that he has connections to the outside world without giving away how much he really knows about her. Or, she could be working for Ben, and all the stuff about her life in England was lip service for Locke's benefit. Or, Richard Malkin could be who I said he was earlier, and he and his wife could be serving as surrogate parents for Charlotte, who perhaps was born on the island.

As far as the jump in her age, Walt seems like a good indicator of how that could be explained, although I won't even attempt to sound all sciency and stuff.

So long story short: Charlotte Lewis IS Charlotte Malkin, a girl with the ability to jump with her consciousness. After a traumatic experience with a river and a strange trip where she met Eko's dead brother, she became obsessed with figuring out her own abilities, as well as the magical place she visited while she was "dead" (the island) and the mysterious connection it all has to her, Eko, flight 815, etc. This would also explain her disbelief at the plane crash and her excitement at finding the now-defunct Dharma logo, if her consciousness was somehow able to jump between the regular world and the island. I see no reason to ignore the physical evidence (Charlotte Lewis looks like a grown up Charlotte Malkin) when this would make her a character that would embody so much of the mystery of Lost.

http://images.lostpedia.com/images/thumb/5/58/Charlotte_malkin.jpg/250px-Charlotte_malkin.jpg http://images.lostpedia.com/images/thumb/1/11/CharlotteS4.jpg/250px-CharlotteS4.jpg


Love the theory dude...Not sure what Charlotte's level of involvement with Ben or Widmore is, but I like the idea that its the same charlotte...the pics really lock it up for me.

nihilance
05-29-2008, 07:29 AM
What's the problem there? They don't use traditional batteries? I never had one.

No...it's got a rechargable lithium battery that requires a screwdriver to remove. Typically you just plug the sucker in to recharge...same with the DS.

bstie1198
05-29-2008, 07:31 AM
Here's a reallllllllllly crazy theory someone posted..

It's about Charlotte.

It's very unlikely, but they raise some interesting points. Specifically the water stuff.

MINOR SPOILER FOR TONIGHT'S FINALE HIDDEN

A coincidence rarely seems to be just that on Lost, and I doubt the writers decided to have two characters both named Charlotte, who also both happen to have red hair and eerie blue eyes. (I'd post images but my post count isn't high enough yet. Look on Lostpedia). It seems impossible that they could be the same person because (1) they have different names and different parents (Ben reveals Charlotte Lewis' parents to be David and Jeanette of Essex) and seemingly two totally unrelated lives, and (2) the ages, we don't have exacts but Charlotte Lewis looks at least a good 5 years older than Charlotte Malkin. But this is Lost, and I think there's a way that makes, uh, sense.

Charlotte Malkin is the daughter of Richard Malkin, and she supposedly drowned and came back to life after being catatonic in a river for a few hours. Richard Malkin, in case it doesn't ring a bell, is the psychic that tells Claire that she must keep her baby, and ends up arranging the flight that will strand her on the island. So right off the bat, his character should seem a little suspect now that we know that there are forces off the island who are still very much involved and connected with it. Mr. Eko investigates Charlotte's case for the Church (her mother believes she is a miracle) and Malkin admits to Eko that he is a fraud, not a psychic. Yet, he knew about Claire. So is he really a fraud and Claire was just so special that he somehow got a flash of something, or is he really a fraud and only "knows" about Claire because someone **coughBencough** told him what he should say to her? Anyway, that's a tangent, but important because I believe that Richard Malkin works for Ben or someone else in some capacity.

So, how could this be Charlotte Lewis? This answer involves Malkin and a potential relationship to the island, the time properties of the island, and the theory that some children are just born special. The incident that Eko goes to investigate regarding the drowned girl makes me believe that Charlotte Malkin and Charlotte Lewis are the same person, a very special girl.

We have learned that time travel or however you chose to label it is possible through consciousness leaps of some sort. Desmond does it, I believe Ben and Alpert and probably others (Faraday) can do it as well. In "The Constant" several of the scenes made it seem to me as if water was somehow important to the leaps (Donnie Darko, anyone?). Desmond leaps when he tries to get a coin from a puddle, he awakes another time in the rain, and Widmore (who knows more than he lets on) left the water running in the sink knowing Des would turn it off, jetisoning him back to his island-inhabiting body. We also learned by seeing Minkowski, that when your consciousness has jumped, your body remains alive while appearing quite dead (because it's an empty vessel at that point). I do not believe that Charlotte Malkin ever drowned and then magically came back to life. I think a young girl decided to play in a river, and woke up 2 hours later after having been "somewhere else", a somewhere else where she happened to meet Eko's brother Yemi, who we now know was dead on the island. While her consciousness was somewhere else, presumably on the island (sparking Charlotte Lewis' character's quest to find this place her mind had gone), her body appeared to be dead. Then her consciousness came back, and she awoke to tell Eko of meeting his brother while she was "between places." I think that Charlotte is a natural born jumper if you will, likely unable to understand or control her ability, which is why she chose the path of the explorer.

Many have already postulated that Charlotte Lewis would end up being a mole for Ben. I agree that their initial interaction was strange, as if they were trying to hard to be strangers. He shoots her in the chest rather than the head, and she happens to be wearing a bulletprof vest. It just seems a little off. So maybe they do know each other. Maybe Ben was interested in young Charlotte, like he is interested in Walt and probably Aaron. That being said, there is no guarantee that Charlotte from the freighter is actually named Charlotte Staples-Lewis, or that her parents are David and Jeanette of Essex. Ben could be lying (WHAT?!), putting on a little show for the Losties and maybe Charlotte herself depending on who she truly is working for. If she really is working for Widmore or Abbadon, perhaps Charlotte Lewis is a real alias of hers, which Ben gives her to show that he has connections to the outside world without giving away how much he really knows about her. Or, she could be working for Ben, and all the stuff about her life in England was lip service for Locke's benefit. Or, Richard Malkin could be who I said he was earlier, and he and his wife could be serving as surrogate parents for Charlotte, who perhaps was born on the island.

As far as the jump in her age, Walt seems like a good indicator of how that could be explained, although I won't even attempt to sound all sciency and stuff.

So long story short: Charlotte Lewis IS Charlotte Malkin, a girl with the ability to jump with her consciousness. After a traumatic experience with a river and a strange trip where she met Eko's dead brother, she became obsessed with figuring out her own abilities, as well as the magical place she visited while she was "dead" (the island) and the mysterious connection it all has to her, Eko, flight 815, etc. This would also explain her disbelief at the plane crash and her excitement at finding the now-defunct Dharma logo, if her consciousness was somehow able to jump between the regular world and the island. I see no reason to ignore the physical evidence (Charlotte Lewis looks like a grown up Charlotte Malkin) when this would make her a character that would embody so much of the mystery of Lost.

http://images.lostpedia.com/images/thumb/5/58/Charlotte_malkin.jpg/250px-Charlotte_malkin.jpg http://images.lostpedia.com/images/thumb/1/11/CharlotteS4.jpg/250px-CharlotteS4.jpg


:crazy:

The fact that people can come up with this type of stuff and it sort-of makes sense is why I love this show so much.

I really like the water idea, especially where it concerns Des and Witmore in the bathroom during The Constant however, I don't buy the whole Charlotte theory presented, especially the assertion that someone "jumping" could be mistaken for dead.

Cth
05-29-2008, 07:47 AM
Yeah, I reposted it mostly because of the water stuff that seemingly went unnoticed (if it's true)

That, and I liked the idea of her doing the Alice in Wonderland thing.

Dreaded Anomaly
05-29-2008, 10:22 AM
Two things:
1) Kristen Bell was originally considered for the role of Charlotte (http://www.tvguide.com/Ask-Ausiello/070808). Doesn't mean they didn't change their mind about the character later on, but it probably wasn't their intention from the start.
2) Rebecca Mader is British, not Australian. The accents sound similar enough to us Americans, but their original intention was for the character to be American (http://community.tvguide.com/blog-entry/TVGuide-Editors-Blog/Ausiello-Report/New-Lost-Star/800033302), which, again, doesn't seem to fit with the depth of this theory.

The water connection seems plausible, though. Maybe that's why Zoe Bell's character jumped off the freighter - she was trying to go back in time.

Cth
05-29-2008, 10:44 AM
Two things:
1) Kristen Bell was originally considered for the role of Charlotte (http://www.tvguide.com/Ask-Ausiello/070808). Doesn't mean they didn't change their mind about the character later on, but it probably wasn't their intention from the start.
2) Rebecca Mader is British, not Australian. The accents sound similar enough to us Americans, but their original intention was for the character to be American (http://community.tvguide.com/blog-entry/TVGuide-Editors-Blog/Ausiello-Report/New-Lost-Star/800033302), which, again, doesn't seem to fit with the depth of this theory.

The water connection seems plausible, though. Maybe that's why Zoe Bell's character jumped off the freighter - she was trying to go back in time.

Someone should collect all the water references to see if there's something more to it.

The Doc went overboard and showed up earlier, but that's more of a 'course heading' thing I'd think.

I wonder if the rain has anything to do with it.

Hrm, and come to think of it, Charlie drowned and went through to the other side (in theory)