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Juggernaut
04-07-2007, 05:54 PM
Preview of my new project from Marvel Comics with superstar writer Robert Kirkman, coming in 2008


http://i15.tinypic.com/2d10n08.jpg

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 05:56 PM
It's like the whole story happened already and I missed it.

Afny
04-07-2007, 06:02 PM
http://www.mgroves.com/images%5Cdo_not_want.jpg

Kirkman, how could you!

Vigilance
04-07-2007, 06:02 PM
So how many shields did Cap have anyway?

Iron Man has one... Bucky has one (on an upcoming Cap cover)... Colbert has one... this is just getting dumb.

Way to make Cap's death seem as much like a gratuitous marketing gimmick as possible Marvel.

half guard
04-07-2007, 06:03 PM
at least liefeld has been consistent in maintaining his horrific attack on comic book art throughout the years.

aside from everything else we could point out, why is the shield shown facing directly at the viewer considering the camera angle AND the angle that the arm is turned at?

ugh.

Afny
04-07-2007, 06:03 PM
Also, why is Cap's shield all chipped and stuff. Doesn't Liefeld know that doesn't happen?

A.Huerta
04-07-2007, 06:04 PM
This is blasphemy, this is madness!

FredC
04-07-2007, 06:07 PM
This is blasphemy, this is madness!

This is CAKETOWN!

Matt O'Keefe
04-07-2007, 06:07 PM
How is Kirkman still getting work at Marvel? I love his Walking Dead, but his mainstream work just isn't selling. Ultimate X-Men has taken a drastic drop since he took on writing chores, and Ant-Man has an extremely small (though insanely devoted) fanbase.

lonesomefool
04-07-2007, 06:08 PM
I didnt know writing a couple of Image books, a run on Ultimate X-Men that bleeds readers, and a book titled Ant-Man that is in cancellation danger makes you a super star writer.

I really like most of the stuff Kirkman puts out, including Ant-Man, Invincible, Walking Dead and Marvel Zombies....but calling him a super star is a BIG stretch.

And while I wont buy it due to my lack of interest in Liefeld, I have no problem with them giving him books so long as other books are not affected by it's schedule.

Hate_Prime
04-07-2007, 06:08 PM
Oh dear.

chazbot
04-07-2007, 06:09 PM
looks like Bucky is all groweds up now

bradical
04-07-2007, 06:09 PM
This is CAKETOWN!

this is athens!



wait... i fucked that up didn't i?

Brad N.
04-07-2007, 06:11 PM
Wait, what? Juggy, you've been Rob Liefeld all along? Did I miss something?

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 06:11 PM
Is that Bucky?

half guard
04-07-2007, 06:11 PM
I didnt know writing a couple of Image books, a run on Ultimate X-Men that bleeds readers, and a book titled Ant-Man that is in cancellation danger makes you a super star writer.

quoted for truthiness.

Kman00001
04-07-2007, 06:13 PM
Killraven? ....nah. :mistrust:

FredC
04-07-2007, 06:14 PM
this is athens!



wait... i fucked that up didn't i?

This is Martha?

Dammit. I'm no good at this.

Matt O'Keefe
04-07-2007, 06:14 PM
Is that Bucky?

No, he was kidding. Bucky has brown hair, not red.

chazbot
04-07-2007, 06:15 PM
quoted for truthiness.

he didn't even mention Jubilee or Marvel Team-Up..... :surrend:

bradical
04-07-2007, 06:15 PM
Killraven? ....nah. :mistrust:

is that who that is? i was thinking lion-o.

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 06:15 PM
Killraven makes sense.

Someone should do a Foolkiller series again.

Hate_Prime
04-07-2007, 06:16 PM
Is that Bucky?

Probably Shatterstar.

Matt O'Keefe
04-07-2007, 06:16 PM
Killraven makes sense.

Someone should do a Foolkiller series again.

So much potential.........

bradical
04-07-2007, 06:17 PM
Killraven makes sense.

Someone should do a Foolkiller series again.

i'm waiting on that plastic man/foolkiller marvel/dc crossover.

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 06:18 PM
i'm waiting on that plastic man/foolkiller marvel/dc crossover.

Wow, that idea really depressed me, and I don't know why. :sad:

bradical
04-07-2007, 06:21 PM
Wow, that idea really depressed me, and I don't know why. :sad:

cause it'll never happen, even though we all know it should.

or shouldn't. depends on one's perspective i guess.

bartleby
04-07-2007, 06:21 PM
Someone should do a Foolkiller series again.

Marvel is. Or just did. I'm not sure. But I remember seeing some preview pages that looked pretty nice.

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 06:22 PM
cause it'll never happen, even though we all know it should.

or shouldn't. depends on one's perspective i guess.

It would be the lowest selling book of all time. :-?

Brad N.
04-07-2007, 06:23 PM
Killraven? ....nah. :mistrust:

I REALLY think it is.

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f50/bnasty316/Killraven_Davis.jpg

James Patrick
04-07-2007, 06:23 PM
Won't join the hate parade, but I do want to make the comment that the sheild looks photoshopped on there -- like it was a last-minute or late addition. The angle or something is wrong.

moonspider
04-07-2007, 06:23 PM
*shoots self*

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 06:24 PM
I REALLY think it is.

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f50/bnasty316/Killraven_Davis.jpg

Brad wins the internet.

bradical
04-07-2007, 06:25 PM
It would be the lowest selling book of all time. :-?

i wouldn't even buy it and it was my idea.

Matt O'Keefe
04-07-2007, 06:27 PM
It would be the lowest selling book of all time. :-?

What if they added Cyberfrog to the team-up?:)


I'd want to buy a vague team-up more than a JLA/Avengers, just because the writers would be able to do basically whatever they wanted.

Kman00001
04-07-2007, 06:33 PM
Killraven with Cap's shield...

http://www.mycomicshop.com/res/unprocessed/fullsize/B214A004C.jpg

Hmmm...

bartleby
04-07-2007, 06:35 PM
Killraven with Cap's shield...

http://www.mycomicshop.com/res/unprocessed/fullsize/B214A004C.jpg

Hmmm...

I believe that's the electrostatic shield though.

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 06:36 PM
Killraven with Cap's shield...

http://www.mycomicshop.com/res/unprocessed/fullsize/B214A004C.jpg

Hmmm...

Yeah, it's definitely Killrave.

"Avengers Forever"? 22 pages is enough.

Joe Henderson
04-07-2007, 06:36 PM
I feel like I'm missing the inside joke here. I assume that shield is photoshopped in there by someone else and it's just a gag, right?

bartleby
04-07-2007, 06:38 PM
Are we sure it's Killraven and not just some new character the Liefeld "created" that looks just like Killraven -- only with two swords?!

bradical
04-07-2007, 06:40 PM
Are we sure it's Killraven and not just some new character the Liefeld "created" that looks just like Killraven -- only with two swords?!

i'm sticking with lion-o.

but i'm on painkillers.

John Drake
04-07-2007, 06:40 PM
When or where was this announced?

Brad N.
04-07-2007, 06:42 PM
Heh. I remember once that Killraven was supposedly going to be revealed to be the son of Franklin Richards.

bradical
04-07-2007, 06:43 PM
When or where was this announced?

4 pages back?

James Patrick
04-07-2007, 06:48 PM
yeah, it's fake or poorly photoshipped. The sheild doesn't look like it's on his hand where it should be, just tacked on, and it's an odd choice to have the sheild and sword on an arm.

KingMob
04-07-2007, 06:49 PM
yeah that drawing looks pretty fucking horrible, what is this 1992?

Gavin
04-07-2007, 06:56 PM
Preview of my new project from Marvel Comics with superstar writer Robert Kirkman, coming in 2008


http://i15.tinypic.com/2d10n08.jpg

Lion-o?

John Drake
04-07-2007, 06:57 PM
4 pages back?

Juggernaut is Liefeld?

Juggernaut
04-07-2007, 06:57 PM
http://www.robliefeld.net/newproject.htm



it is legit and rob mentions it in his forum as a project he is doing aside from Onslaught returns. Supposedly he is 12 pages already drawn.

John Drake
04-07-2007, 06:57 PM
http://www.robliefeld.net/newproject.htm



it is legit and rob mentions it in his forum as a project he is doing aside from Onslaught returns. Supposedly he is 12 pages already drawn.

Ah, ok thanks.

Juggernaut
04-07-2007, 06:57 PM
Juggernaut is Liefeld?

No,I just forgot to put Liefeld's quote in parenthesis.

Vigilance
04-07-2007, 07:01 PM
yeah that drawing looks pretty fucking horrible, what is this 1992?

It's always 1992 for Rob Liefield.

Jamie Coville
04-07-2007, 07:05 PM
No shit. Everybody is dead already. Now what?

half guard
04-07-2007, 07:06 PM
yeah, it's fake or poorly photoshipped.

not fake, but definitely photoshopped; by liefeld no less. :lol:

Jacob Lyon Goddard
04-07-2007, 07:12 PM
Killraven?

Masculine Todd
04-07-2007, 07:14 PM
This board always makes me feel as though I'm the only fan of Liefeld left in the world...but then I see the sales figures for the titles he does and I find that I'm not alone by a longshot. :smile:

NickT
04-07-2007, 07:15 PM
http://i15.tinypic.com/2d10n08.jpg
It's L'Oreal, and he's worth it.

Matt O'Keefe
04-07-2007, 07:16 PM
This board always makes me feel as though I'm the only fan of Liefeld left in the world...but then I see the sales figures for the titles he does and I find that I'm not alone by a longshot. :smile:

It's not as much about his art as it is his poor decisions that he's made since the early 90s.

Brad N.
04-07-2007, 07:21 PM
For those not familiar with him, from Wiki:




Killraven
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
Killraven

Publisher Marvel Comics
First appearance Amazing Adventures #18 (May 1973)
Created by Roy Thomas
Neal Adams

Characteristics
Alter ego Jonathan Raven
Affiliations Freemen
Notable aliases K.R.
Abilities Ability to project consciousness

Jonathan Raven, a.k.a. Killraven, the "Warrior of the Worlds", is a fictional freedom fighter in a post-apocalyptic alternate future of the Marvel Comics universe. He first appeared in Amazing Adventures #18 (May 1973), created by co-plotters Roy Thomas and Neal Adams, scripter Gerry Conway, and penciler Adams. The series featured the first interracial kiss in comic books.[1]

Contents [hide]
1 Publishing history
2 Fictional character biography
2.1 Supporting cast
3 Other Killravens
4 Movie
5 Trivia
6 Bibliography
7 See also
8 Footnotes
9 References
10 External link



[edit] Publishing history
Following the multiple-creator goulash of the first issue — in which the two originators and co-plotters turned the scripting over to another writer, and artist co-creator Neal Adams penciling only the first 11 pages and Howard Chaykin the remaining nine — came one issue fully written by debut scripter Gerry Conway, and then another Marv Wolfman. After this, the book became the province of writer Don McGregor for a highly acclaimed run [2] from #21 (Nov. 1973) to the final issue, #39 (Nov. 1976). Pencillers were Herb Trimpe, Rich Buckler, Gene Colan, and, most notably, P. Craig Russell from issue #27 on.

Aside from McGregor, with whom the character became as associated as Howard the Duck and Man-Thing with Steve Gerber or Tomb of Dracula with Marv Wolfman, other writers include Bill Mantlo (a fill-in Amazing Adventures and a Marvel Team-Up with Killraven and a future-flung Spider-Man); Joe Linsner (a 2001 Marvel Knights one-shot, set in 2020 New York City, at odds with the original series' locale by that fictional year); and Alan Davis (also artist), in a 2002 parallel universe miniseries.


[edit] Fictional character biography
On the alternate-future Earth designated Earth-691 by Marvel Comics, the Martians from H. G. Wells' War of the Worlds returned in 2001 for another attempt at conquering the planet. (They were later retconned as extrasolar aliens using Mars as a staging area). After humanity's enslavement, men not used as breeders or collaborators were trained and forced to battle gladiator-style for the Martians' amusement; women were used as breeders to supply infants, eaten by the Martians as a delicacy. Jonathan Raven, dubbed Killraven as his gladiatorial nom de guerre, escaped with the help of the gladiatorial "keeper", but without his brother, Deathraven. Killraven joined the Freemen, a group of freedom fighters against Martian oppression.

The story follows Killraven and his companions from 2018 through 2020 as they travel across the eastern portion of North America, from New York City to Cape Canaveral while searching for Killraven's lost brother. Pursued by the cyborg Skar, the Freeman encounter various victims of Martian transhuman experiments, as well as emotionally and psychologically scarred survivors. According to writer McGregor, some story ideas that did not make it into the book before cancellation were explored in his graphic novel Sabre.[citation needed]

Spoiler warning: Plot and/or ending details follow.
The Freeman encounter Killraven's brother, Deathraven, and discover he has become a Martian collaborator in a sequel graphic novel, Killraven, Warrior of the Worlds (Marvel Graphic Novel #7, 1983).


[edit] Supporting cast
Killraven's Freemen allies included his African-American "mud-brother", M’Shulla Scott, and the feisty scientist Carmilla Frost, who shared comic books' earliest known interracial kiss, in issue #31 (July 1975), page nine, final panel; the cynical and bitter Hawk; the slow-witted strongman Old Skull; the Mae West-like Volcana Ash; the human/plant hybrid Mint Julep; and Grok, the severely damaged clone of Carmilla's father.

Antagonists, besides the Martians and Skar, included Pstun-Rage, the Death-Breeders, Atalon the Fear Master, the Sacrificer and Abraxas.


[edit] Other Killravens

Killraven (2002 miniseres) #3. Cover art by Alan Davis.There have been counterparts of Killraven in several stories:

Following minor controversy among fans whether the Killraven of Amazing Adventures is the same as that depicted in the past of the Guardians of the Galaxy, the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe: Alternate Universes 2005 established that Killraven and the Guardians share the same timeline, christened "Earth-691". The relationship to the mainstream timeline, Earth-616, is unclear. The Handbook also established the Killraven of the 2002-2003 miniseries Paradise X as the "real" (Earth-691) Killraven.
The 1998-1999 miniseries Avengers Forever had Killraven as a member of an alternate future Avengers (Earth-9930) led by the Black Panther.
Alan Davis' 2002 miniseries Killraven (Earth-2120) depicted an alternate-future variation of the original series.

[edit] Movie
Hollywood trade stories in 2005 reported plans to adapt Killraven for a theatrical motion picture, with Marvel and Sony Pictures in negotiations with Robert Schenkkan to write a script.[3] [4]


[edit] Trivia
Neal Adams' early ideas for Killraven involved him being the son of a Doc Savage archetype.[5]
Killraven's story has similarities to Battlefield Earth, with a group of ex-slaves fighting alien oppressors on a conquered Earth, though this is not an uncommon theme in science fiction.
In 2005, writer Jim Valentino said his aborted plans for the Marvel comic Guardians of the Galaxy involved Killraven, in his 50s, joining the team and forming an attraction to Yellowjacket (Rita DeMara). Valentino said he would have established Franklin Richards as Killraven's father.[6]
In Marvel's Howard the Duck Vol. 1, #2 (March 1976), Howard dreamt he was "Killmallard", a freedom fighter battling alien overlords who used tripods identical to those of Killraven's Martian opponents.

Ethan Van Sciver
04-07-2007, 07:23 PM
This board always makes me feel as though I'm the only fan of Liefeld left in the world...but then I see the sales figures for the titles he does and I find that I'm not alone by a longshot. :smile:

I'm a fan of his. He's interesting.

Brad N.
04-07-2007, 07:25 PM
Anyone that can draw better than me has my respect. I can't draw worth shit, Liefled can. I have no real problem or hate for the guy...although I do giggle when I hear him give crit about perspective and anatomy to up and comers.

Thudpucker
04-07-2007, 07:31 PM
Killraven? ....nah. :mistrust:

Please, don't even think something so terrible! I've been wishing for years for a Killraven relaunch....

but not like this! NOT LIKE THIS!!!!!!!! :Panic:

half guard
04-07-2007, 07:33 PM
Anyone that can draw better than me

well, yeah but that's not saying much...

*runs away*























j/k brad :lol:

Humphrey_Lee
04-07-2007, 07:33 PM
It's not as much about his art as it is his poor decisions that he's made since the early 90s.

Shilling whatever Marvel has for him to do since his own stuff folded by now?

Nah, it's just the bad art.

NickT
04-07-2007, 07:36 PM
This board always makes me feel as though I'm the only fan of Liefeld left in the world...but then I see the sales figures for the titles he does and I find that I'm not alone by a longshot. :smile:
You're not alone by a Longshot.






...Not even Longshot likes him. It's just you alone.




;) :razz:



He's not my thing, but I'm not hating on the guy for it.

Brad N.
04-07-2007, 07:37 PM
well, yeah but that's not saying much...

*runs away*























j/k brad :lol:

no, no. This is true.

Maestro
04-07-2007, 07:53 PM
Lion-o?

I see the resemblance

http://i17.tinypic.com/2nbyf03.jpg

bairdduvessa
04-07-2007, 08:37 PM
he's getting better

half guard
04-07-2007, 08:54 PM
I see the resemblance

http://i17.tinypic.com/2nbyf03.jpg

hehe. awesome!

A.Huerta
04-07-2007, 09:45 PM
Anyone that can draw better than me has my respect. I can't draw worth shit, Liefled can. I have no real problem or hate for the guy...although I do giggle when I hear him give crit about perspective and anatomy to up and comers.

Trust me when I say this... you CAN draw better than Liefeld. :lol:

bradical
04-07-2007, 09:51 PM
I see the resemblance

http://i17.tinypic.com/2nbyf03.jpg

that's great.

LilPoe
04-07-2007, 09:59 PM
So that isn't Major Victory is it?

Shepherd
04-07-2007, 10:31 PM
I think you guys are being a little too harsh. As far as Liefeld art goes, this isn't too bad. It's not really my tastes, but it's good for what it is. And as far as Kirkman, I think he gets WAY too much flack. His Walking Dead is my favorite comic, Invincible is great, and Marvel Team-up was a lot of fun. Sure, UXM isn't perfect, but I don't think it's terrible either. I actually really enjoyed the Cable story.

R

Master Jack Rabbitt
04-07-2007, 10:44 PM
This is blasphemy, this is madness!

THIS. IS. JINXWORLD!

Master Jack Rabbitt
04-07-2007, 10:45 PM
he's getting better

Absolutely. His work lately has been soooo much improved over his older stuff.

bairdduvessa
04-07-2007, 10:54 PM
Absolutely. His work lately has been soooo much improved over his older stuff.

i've never really had a problem with his stuff. it's just art. and not only that comic book art. (although i do hate his wolverine and his recent deadpool pieces)

Master Jack Rabbitt
04-07-2007, 11:02 PM
i've never really had a problem with his stuff. it's just art. and not only that comic book art. (although i do hate his wolverine and his recent deadpool pieces)

I've been a Liefeld supporter for the most part of the years, but the art does have some quirks to it and there has been times where I've not enjoyed it (such as the recent Teen Titans two-parter). And it has definitely improved lately.

And lets not forget that the man gave us Deadpool.

bairdduvessa
04-07-2007, 11:23 PM
I've been a Liefeld supporter for the most part of the years, but the art does have some quirks to it and there has been times where I've not enjoyed it (such as the recent Teen Titans two-parter). And it has definitely improved lately.

And lets not forget that the man gave us Deadpool.

that could be why i've never hated him...

:grope:

Marcdachamp
04-07-2007, 11:30 PM
I can't believe it took you guys that long to realize it was Killraven. What kind of dorks are you?

Dr. Omega
04-07-2007, 11:49 PM
Absolutely. His work lately has been soooo much improved over his older stuff.
Are you people high? There is absolutely no difference. No change. No improvement. No style change.

Liefeld is to comics:
What W is to politics.
What Gigli is to movies.
What new Coke was to soda.


He is:
Star Trek V
Rocky V
Highlander 2

Comics companies need to be hiring talented folk, like our own Professor Oreo, not hacks like Liefeld.


Dr. Ω

WinterRose
04-08-2007, 12:01 AM
Wait... is that shatterstar? It is isn't it. I thought that mook was dead by now. Why isn't he dead? The explanation for this idiocy. I demand it.

bairdduvessa
04-08-2007, 12:07 AM
Are you people high? There is absolutely no difference. No change. No improvement. No style change.

Liefeld is to comics:
What W is to politics.
What Gigli is to movies.
What new Coke was to soda.


He is:
Star Trek V
Rocky V
Highlander 2

Comics companies need to be hiring talented folk, like our own Professor Oreo, not hacks like Liefeld.


Dr. Ω

i liked star trek 5 more than 2 :-P

WinterRose
04-08-2007, 12:14 AM
Wait... is that shatterstar? It is isn't it. I thought that mook was dead by now. Why isn't he dead? The explanation for this idiocy. I demand it.

Joe Henderson
04-08-2007, 12:57 AM
http://www.robliefeld.net/newproject.htm



it is legit and rob mentions it in his forum as a project he is doing aside from Onslaught returns. Supposedly he is 12 pages already drawn.

Wow, the shield looks so poorly placed I thought for sure it was a fake. How bizarre...

Blandy vs Terrorism
04-08-2007, 01:04 AM
Sorry, Kirkman, I'm a big fan, but I ain't buying it if Liefeld is working on it.

Blandy vs Terrorism
04-08-2007, 01:05 AM
Wow, the shield looks so poorly placed I thought for sure it was a fake. How bizarre...

Either this is sarcasm, or you're forgetting that this is Rob Liefeld we're talking about. ;)

Ravengregory
04-08-2007, 02:23 AM
Won't join the hate parade, but I do want to make the comment that the sheild looks photoshopped on there -- like it was a last-minute or late addition. The angle or something is wrong.

yup, the angle looks all types of fucked up.

And yeah for Killraven.

mario
04-08-2007, 03:00 AM
he didn't even mention Jubilee or Marvel Team-Up..... :surrend:

I downloaded the Jubilee series to see what it was about.
Damn, that was an awkward series. :no:

DaveCummings
04-08-2007, 03:09 AM
It's funny. I thought there was a rule here against just randomly bashing comic professionals. But it seems it gets a pass when it comes to Rob Liefeld or Michael Turner.

~Dave

bartleby
04-08-2007, 04:17 AM
It's funny. I thought there was a rule here against just randomly bashing comic professionals. But it seems it gets a pass when it comes to Rob Liefeld or Michael Turner.


Don't hate the player; hate the game.

Artie Pink
04-08-2007, 04:31 AM
That looks like dookie.

My store invented a "-1" Previews code specifically for Liefeld fill-ins for package customers who got Teen Titans.

Humphrey_Lee
04-08-2007, 04:33 AM
Sorry, Kirkman, I'm a big fan, but I ain't buying it if Liefeld is working on it.

Sadly, Liefeld's name will double or even triple the sales that Kirkman would just get by himself. :surrend:

ClintP
04-08-2007, 04:40 AM
I like the image of the Carnage: It's a Wonderful life in the original poster's sig. I actually have that comic and bought it new when I was in hich school.

Vigilance
04-08-2007, 05:52 AM
Yanno... that pic really annoys me.

When I heard about Cap's death, I really never consider that Marvel might F it up. I didn't think Steve Rogers was going to STAY DEAD or anything silly like that, but I certainly didn't expect multiple covers of people carrying cap's shield to start popping up right and left.

By my count there's already been THREE images put out of someone else using what looks like Cap's shield.

So I guess we now have the answer to what Cap's death means to the MU: huge boom in Shield sales.

Thanks Marvel. :blah:

NickT
04-08-2007, 06:29 AM
Yanno... that pic really annoys me.

When I heard about Cap's death, I really never consider that Marvel might F it up. I didn't think Steve Rogers was going to STAY DEAD or anything silly like that, but I certainly didn't expect multiple covers of people carrying cap's shield to start popping up right and left.

By my count there's already been THREE images put out of someone else using what looks like Cap's shield.

So I guess we now have the answer to what Cap's death means to the MU: huge boom in Shield sales.

Thanks Marvel. :blah:
Jumping to conclusions a bit aren't you?

lonesomefool
04-08-2007, 06:36 AM
You REALLY didnt expect that?

Cap's death was a HUGE sales hit, it only makes sense that Marvel would try to make as much money off of it as possible, they are a company after all.

NickT
04-08-2007, 06:42 AM
You REALLY didnt expect that?

Cap's death was a HUGE sales hit, it only makes sense that Marvel would try to make as much money off of it as possible, they are a company after all.
But who says this is anything to do with it? Ultimates 13 will have the shield on the cover, will that be to do with it?

Vigilance
04-08-2007, 06:51 AM
Jumping to conclusions a bit aren't you?

Given that Cap's comic hasn't even advanced ONE issue past his death, and we've already seen three different people with the shield and one guy wearing a take-off on his costume...

No, I really don't think I am "jumping to conclusions".

Im not entirely sure who, but someone at marvel made statement that "you won't have four guys running around pretending to be him". (a reference to death of Superman)

Uhhuh... just three guys with his shield and punisher in his costume...

Im not even sure what "conclusion" I'm jumping to. I thought Marvel would handle his death as something other than a big hype-fest. With three different people carrying his shield already, it's ALREADY that.

lonesomefool
04-08-2007, 06:52 AM
Considering Liefeld's schedule, chances are this project will come out right about the time Cap comes back, but I was talking about the OTHER projects, Marvel knows that Cap's death is "hot" right now and is gonna try to make as much cash off it as they can, not doing so would be passing up money, something most companies dont do.

Plus, both of those books that are doing that whole Cap's shield cover are actually good, Punisher: War Journal and Captain America.

NickT
04-08-2007, 06:53 AM
Given that Cap's comic hasn't even advanced ONE issue past his death, and we've already seen three different people with the shield and one guy wearing a take-off on his costume...

No, I really don't think I am "jumping to conclusions".

Im not entirely sure who, but someone at marvel made statement that "you won't have four guys running around pretending to be him". (a reference to death of Superman)

Uhhuh... just three guys with his shield and punisher in his costume...

Im not even sure what "conclusion" I'm jumping to. I thought Marvel would handle his death as something other than a big hype-fest. With three different people carrying his shield already, it's ALREADY that.
Well for starters, where does it state that this is current-timeline 616?

Vigilance
04-08-2007, 06:54 AM
You REALLY didnt expect that?

Cap's death was a HUGE sales hit, it only makes sense that Marvel would try to make as much money off of it as possible, they are a company after all.

Right, I get that they are a company. But being a company doesn't make every short-term benefit a good idea.

When Superman died, for instance, DC clearly had a plan to capitalize on the media event... and make money.

But I felt like they had a PLAN. I just feel like Marvel has been sort of taken aback by the huge reaction Cap's death has sparked, and are running around trying to get the shield out there as much as possible now.

And remember, Marvel went out of their way to assure us that this wasn't just some media grab. At least, that was the impression I got.

Again, maybe Im naive.

Vigilance
04-08-2007, 06:56 AM
Well for starters, where does it state that this is current-timeline 616?

It's possible it isn't. Like I said... the pic just rubbed me the wrong way. It just seems like everytime I turn around these days, there's a pic of someone else using Cap's shield.

lonesomefool
04-08-2007, 07:00 AM
One of those people trying to grab Cap's shield is Bucky, and that is in the regular Captain America book, you cant hold that against Marvel.

The other one is Punisher War Journal which is a good book, and while I'm curious to see what Fraction does with it, considering Frank Castle is kinda nuts and looked up to Cap, it doesnt shock me he would try to get his SHIELD.

If Nightcrawler was holding Cap's SHIELD, then you might have an argument, but two books and now this pin up of a project that is likely out of continuity, really isnt THAT bad.

Vigilance
04-08-2007, 07:01 AM
No, Punisher has a cap-like costume, he doesn't have the shield to my knowledge.

I was referring to Bucky (who I can buy), Iron Man (blech) and now Lion-o or whomever this is.

lonesomefool
04-08-2007, 07:07 AM
The Liefeld project doesnt take place in continuity though, I am assuming, because like I said, with his schedule it would be dated by the time it came out.

Bucky SHOULD have the Shield, it's taking place in the Captain America book.

And considering Tony probably feels guilty about Cap's death, him having the Shield, isnt that big of a deal either.

Like I said, when Nightcrawler or Beast start carring it around, then it will be bad.

Vigilance
04-08-2007, 07:09 AM
It's not the choices of who has the shield, so much as it is that all three images are out simultaneously. I personally would prefer not seeing a different person holding Cap's shield every time I turn around.

And again, I didn't say it was "bad", curse Marvel's name or wish harm to Liefield.

I said it rubbed me the wrong way.

Cause it does.

Foolish Mortal
04-08-2007, 07:29 AM
I can't believe it took you guys that long to realize it was Killraven. What kind of dorks are you?
Yes, I'm also quite disappointed in you guys. :no:

And yes, Killraven takes place in an alternate reality because the alien invasion that would have taken place in 2001 in the 616 universe never happened.

lonesomefool
04-08-2007, 07:46 AM
I wasnt aware 2 books closely tied to the storyline and a random pin-up are "every time I turn around". Not trying to put you down or anything, I just think your making a bigger deal out of this than you should be, just try to enjoy the stories.

Matt Jay
04-08-2007, 07:53 AM
This is just weird. On a side note, how hilarious would it be if Liefeld did some fill-in issues on Mighty Avengers?

Foolish Mortal
04-08-2007, 07:56 AM
This is just weird. On a side note, how hilarious would it be if Liefeld did some fill-in issues on Mighty Avengers?
*SHHSH!* Don't give Quesada any ideas. :scared:

Lanowar
04-08-2007, 08:36 AM
I think Shortpacked! sums up how people feel when Liefeld is involved

http://www.shortpacked.com/comics/20070319thespirit.png

Donal DeLay
04-08-2007, 09:25 AM
Originally Posted by A.Huerta
This is blasphemy, this is madness!

THIS. IS. JINXWORLD!
You've just been sig'ed. Greatest paraphrasing ever in the history of Jinxworld.

The Zevad
04-08-2007, 09:36 AM
Is that Killraven?

Master Jack Rabbitt
04-08-2007, 10:14 AM
You've just been sig'ed. Greatest paraphrasing ever in the history of Jinxworld.

:thumb:


Is that Killraven?

Yes.

DaveCummings
04-08-2007, 10:19 AM
It's possible it isn't. Like I said... the pic just rubbed me the wrong way. It just seems like everytime I turn around these days, there's a pic of someone else using Cap's shield.


Yeah, but if that is Killraven, it's not the first time we've seen him carrying Cap's shield. I mean, someone already posted this pic earlier in the thread from Avengers Forever;

http://www.mycomicshop.com/res/unprocessed/fullsize/B214A004C.jpg

So, you might want to take a step back from the keyboard and take a deep breath before going off about it.

~Dave

A.Huerta
04-08-2007, 10:53 AM
Ive only seen 2 people with Caps shield. Iron Man and Winter Soldier and those 2 were close to Cap.

half guard
04-08-2007, 11:02 AM
Are you people high? There is absolutely no difference. No change. No improvement. No style change.

Liefeld is to comics:
What W is to politics.
What Gigli is to movies.
What new Coke was to soda.


He is:
Star Trek V
Rocky V
Highlander 2

Comics companies need to be hiring talented folk, like our own Professor Oreo, not hacks like Liefeld.


Dr. Ω

i fully support this post.

half guard
04-08-2007, 11:05 AM
It's funny. I thought there was a rule here against just randomly bashing comic professionals. But it seems it gets a pass when it comes to Rob Liefeld or Michael Turner.

~Dave

no one is "randomly bashing" him. they are however pointing out obvious flaws in perspective / anatomy / etc of the art. liefeld's art has always been plagued with flaws. that's nothing new. he tries to cover his lack of actual skill through the use of dynamic poses and outrageous costumes.

to be fair, i'll point out 2 positives about this particular picture:

1) the surprising lack of shoulder pads
2) the fact that he actually drew the feet of not just one, but TWO characters.

DaveCummings
04-08-2007, 11:24 AM
no one is "randomly bashing" him. they are however pointing out obvious flaws in perspective / anatomy / etc of the art. liefeld's art has always been plagued with flaws. that's nothing new. he tries to cover his lack of actual skill through the use of dynamic poses and outrageous costumes.

to be fair, i'll point out 2 positives about this particular picture:

1) the surprising lack of shoulder pads
2) the fact that he actually drew the feet of not just one, but TWO characters.

There are a few people who I thought that they crossed the line from constructive criticism into bashing, like someone earlier on, commenting that they should "shoot themself" or something like that. Which is this post , (http://www.606studios.com/bendisboard/showpost.php?p=2934454&postcount=32)

Or This post , (http://www.606studios.com/bendisboard/showpost.php?p=2934535&postcount=46) which I thought was pretty harsh.

Just saying.

Foolish Mortal
04-08-2007, 11:46 AM
Ive only seen 2 people with Caps shield. Iron Man and Winter Soldier and those 2 were close to Cap.

http://i18.tinypic.com/43xye5x.jpg
Major Victory

A.Huerta
04-08-2007, 11:49 AM
I meant recently.

justjeffery
04-08-2007, 11:49 AM
Man.. that makes my heart hurt... kinda like when Bendis worked for McDouchelane.

I swore I'd never ever buy a Liefeld (or McDicklane) book ever again, but its Kirkman and it'll be really good...

Damn you!!!!!!!

half guard
04-08-2007, 11:52 AM
There are a few people who I thought that they crossed the line from constructive criticism into bashing, like someone earlier on, commenting that they should "shoot themself" or something like that. Which is this post , (http://www.606studios.com/bendisboard/showpost.php?p=2934454&postcount=32)

Or This post , (http://www.606studios.com/bendisboard/showpost.php?p=2934535&postcount=46) which I thought was pretty harsh.

Just saying.

to be fair, kingmob was criticizing the art itself, not "randomly bashing" the creator as a person; regardless of how harsh some people might think it is.

as for moonspider, he was obviously joking about shooting himself. i don't see how that equals "randomly bashing" the creator.

lonesomefool
04-08-2007, 11:53 AM
Kinda like the Ultimate X-Men annual by Kirkman and Larrocca was really good? No offense, but if you dont like both the art and the writing, why buy it?

Not trying to question your taste or anything, just curious why you would shell out 2.99-3.99 per issue for a book you dont seem all that excited about.

Foolish Mortal
04-08-2007, 11:54 AM
I meant recently.
Oh. :)

But it's clear that's Killraven in the pic which takes place in an alternate reality, unless they are going to try and somehow shoehorn him into 616 continuity.

Mek
04-08-2007, 11:57 AM
I meant recently.

An off-topic note: You're the guy who did this drawing (http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/52057917/)? Holy crap! It's a total CRIME it hasn't gotten more attention on DA.
Then again, this IS the same site where posting a 10 minute drawing of Axel and Roxas from Kingdom Hearts 2 having wild buttsex will get you over 9,000 favorites....

Seriously though, what an awesome drawing.

But I digress.

Anyhow, umm... Liefeld. I guess I can't criticize him too much since I'm not exactly top tier talent m'self, but still... it is kinda sad that I can't tell this drawing apart from his older ones, save for the shiny new Photoshop color coat of paint.

Yannick_B
04-08-2007, 12:02 PM
http://i18.tinypic.com/43xye5x.jpg
Major Victory

What a douchebaggy cover. But I do want to read it.

Mek
04-08-2007, 12:09 PM
http://i18.tinypic.com/43xye5x.jpg
Major Victory

I love how everyone has the same exact trapezoidal smile and squinty eyes.

Marcdachamp
04-08-2007, 12:11 PM
This is just weird. On a side note, how hilarious would it be if Liefeld did some fill-in issues on Mighty Avengers?

Leave. NOW.

Dan McLellan
04-08-2007, 12:15 PM
So does the creator bashing ban rule only apply to people that this board likes. I got banned for talking negatively about Frank Miller. And here we are 7 pages into a thread bashing rob liefeld.


Stop being hypocrites or grow some thicker skin people.

Foolish Mortal
04-08-2007, 12:16 PM
What a douchebaggy cover. But I do want to read it.
Guardians was a fun little series. One of the brighter spots of the 90's.

A.Huerta
04-08-2007, 12:22 PM
So does the creator bashing ban rule only apply to people that this board likes. I got banned for talking negatively about Frank Miller. And here we are 7 pages into a thread bashing rob liefeld.


Stop being hypocrites or grow some thicker skin people.

We're bashing his art not him. I remember u saying shit about Miller himself, tho.

justjeffery
04-08-2007, 12:23 PM
So does the creator bashing ban rule only apply to people that this board likes. I got banned for talking negatively about Frank Miller. And here we are 7 pages into a thread bashing rob liefeld.


Stop being hypocrites or grow some thicker skin people.

Page 16, subsection 69-b

Creator bashing is not allowed unless the creator in questions is
1. Todd McFarlane
2. Rob Liefeld
3. Brian Bendis

Knowledge is power...

Dan McLellan
04-08-2007, 12:25 PM
We're bashing his art not him. I remember u saying shit about Miller himself, tho.

I call BS, but whatever. I'm not gonna get banned again. But if you think this thread was made for any other reason than to make fun of Rob Liefeld, you are fooling yourself.

James Patrick
04-08-2007, 12:26 PM
Page 16, subsection 69-b

Creator bashing is not allowed unless the creator in questions is
1. Todd McFarlane
2. Rob Liefeld
3. Brian Bendis

4. God.

half guard
04-08-2007, 12:27 PM
So does the creator bashing ban rule only apply to people that this board likes. I got banned for talking negatively about Frank Miller. And here we are 7 pages into a thread bashing rob liefeld.


Stop being hypocrites or grow some thicker skin people.


We're bashing his art not him. I remember u saying shit about Miller himself, tho.

thank you. seriously, why is it so fucking hard for people to understand that. no one here has said "liefeld is a dickhead" or whatever. the fact of the matter is the guy has glaring flaws in everything he draws and tries to cover it with lots of details, dynamic poses, etc. didn't erik larsen say something about a gold covered turd still being nothing but shit at the core or whatever?

half guard
04-08-2007, 12:27 PM
I call BS, but whatever. I'm not gonna get banned again. But if you think this thread was made for any other reason than to make fun of Rob Liefeld, you are fooling yourself.

actually, i believe you're wrong. if i'm not mistaken, the guy who started the thread is a liefeld fan.

Vigilance
04-08-2007, 12:51 PM
Yeah, but if that is Killraven, it's not the first time we've seen him carrying Cap's shield. I mean, someone already posted this pic earlier in the thread from Avengers Forever;

http://www.mycomicshop.com/res/unprocessed/fullsize/B214A004C.jpg

So, you might want to take a step back from the keyboard and take a deep breath before going off about it.

~Dave

I was "going off" about it?

I said it bugs me.

I really had no idea something bugging me was a mortal sin. You're the second poster in this thread to take me to task for having the audacity to let something bug me.

Here, I'll say it real slow:

It. bugs. me.

I have been perfectly civil about that, while trying to respond to lonesomefool and express why it bugged me, but I don't need anyone's permission, nor do I need to prove to you that it's worthy of bugging me.

It just bugs me.

Garra
04-08-2007, 01:44 PM
I didnt know writing a couple of Image books, a run on Ultimate X-Men that bleeds readers, and a book titled Ant-Man that is in cancellation danger makes you a super star writer.

I really like most of the stuff Kirkman puts out, including Ant-Man, Invincible, Walking Dead and Marvel Zombies....but calling him a super star is a BIG stretch.

And while I wont buy it due to my lack of interest in Liefeld, I have no problem with them giving him books so long as other books are not affected by it's schedule.


Dont forget Battle Pope.

Kirkman is a super star in my book. His creator owned titles are consistantly some of the best books on the market in my humble opinion. And he has a new one coming out with Wolf Man debuting on free comic book day.

His Marvel Team Up issues werent to bad, and as already mentioned his Ant Man is bordering on cancelation, but when has Ant Man ever been a big seller? To his credit his take on Ant Man has garnered the most attention of any other Ant Man comic I ever heard of my self.

And Marvel Zombies was a huge success wasnt it? Its gotten tons of attention, won him some awards, and created a new universe that several other books keep crossing into now for stories. And of course it already has a new spin off mini which is currently going.

And I'm certain I have left something out, but all in all, thats a pretty damn good resume. If not an all -star, certainly a rising star.

I do agree with you though on his UXmen run. I have collected UXM since issue 1, and I am planning on dropping it with in the next few issues.

Lanowar
04-08-2007, 01:49 PM
4. God.

As a creator yea god is really bad I mean he retconned the dinosaurs with some "Asteroid" plot line that really stunk oh and the whole "err I don't want to do Romans anymore so I'll get the vikings to ransack them and make them the stars?" bad call.

His latest stuff' is OK I guess

DaveCummings
04-08-2007, 01:49 PM
I was "going off" about it?

I said it bugs me.

I really had no idea something bugging me was a mortal sin. You're the second poster in this thread to take me to task for having the audacity to let something bug me.

Here, I'll say it real slow:

It. bugs. me.

I have been perfectly civil about that, while trying to respond to lonesomefool and express why it bugged me, but I don't need anyone's permission, nor do I need to prove to you that it's worthy of bugging me.

It just bugs me.


I said "going off" about it because you seemed to be annoyed about the use of the shield. No need for the assholish "I'll say it really slow" remark.

Ben
04-08-2007, 01:54 PM
Is that Vance Astro of the Guardians of the Galaxy?

c. page
04-08-2007, 02:06 PM
Is that Vance Astro of the Guardians of the Galaxy?

"major victory"?

yeah... :(

Hate_Prime
04-08-2007, 02:11 PM
I was "going off" about it?

I said it bugs me.

I really had no idea something bugging me was a mortal sin. You're the second poster in this thread to take me to task for having the audacity to let something bug me.

Here, I'll say it real slow:

It. bugs. me.

I have been perfectly civil about that, while trying to respond to lonesomefool and express why it bugged me, but I don't need anyone's permission, nor do I need to prove to you that it's worthy of bugging me.

It just bugs me.

Settle down, fella. No need to go off.

Is there something bugging you?

Matt Jay
04-09-2007, 09:01 AM
I just checked out the Newsarama counterpart to this thread. Liefeld actually shows up. He seems like a really cool guy. I don't like his art, but I have respect for the man. He doesn't let us haters get him down. A class act.

ds9
04-09-2007, 09:04 AM
i like it

Afny
04-09-2007, 09:06 AM
i like it

And now we can lock the thread.

King of Mars
04-09-2007, 09:33 AM
It's funny. I thought there was a rule here against just randomly bashing comic professionals. But it seems it gets a pass when it comes to Rob Liefeld or Michael Turner.

~DaveI think Bendis and the mods realize it's impossible to fight the childish, mob mentality that takes over anytime certain creators are mentioned.

"Maybe we just don't like shitty art! Nyah!"

Shut the fuck up. That's bullshit. There's a world of difference between a fair, objective critique and mindless creator bashing. The Liefeld threads always contain a lot of really obvious, mindless bashing.

Yeah, Liefeld's a less than spectacular storyteller who constantly fucks up characters' anatomy, but he's done plenty of good, stand alone covers, panels, and splash pages over the years. Give him credit when it's deserved and maybe I'll start to believe that some of the negativity I see comes from legitimate attempts to objectively critique his work. Right now, it all seems like the sort of mindless, fanboy sniping that most of the people on this board claim to dislike when it's aimed at more popular figures in the comic world.

Donal DeLay
04-09-2007, 09:39 AM
I just checked out the Newsarama counterpart to this thread. Liefeld actually shows up. He seems like a really cool guy. I don't like his art, but I have respect for the man. He doesn't let us haters get him down. A class act. Why should he? He knows it's going to sell well.

Donal DeLay
04-09-2007, 09:42 AM
I think Bendis and the mods realize it's impossible to fight the childish, mob mentality that takes over anytime certain creators are mentioned.

"Maybe we just don't like shitty art! Nyah!"

Shut the fuck up. That's bullshit. There's a world of difference between a fair, objective critique and mindless creator bashing. The Liefeld threads always contain a lot of really obvious, mindless bashing.

Yeah, Liefeld's a less than spectacular storyteller who constantly fucks up characters' anatomy, but he's done plenty of good, stand alone covers, panels, and splash pages over the years. Give him credit when it's deserved and maybe I'll start to believe that some of the negativity I see comes from legitimate attempts to objectively critique his work. Right now, it all seems like the sort of mindless, fanboy sniping that most of the people on this board claim to dislike when it's aimed at more popular figures in the comic world.

Besides the fact that the rules are pick&choose enforced, I don't think they shut down Liefeld threads because 90% of the posts are complaining about his ART, not HIM. It's not like every post is calling him a retarded douche. They're just saying they don't like his art in an infantile, unconstructive way.

half guard
04-09-2007, 09:43 AM
Settle down, fella. No need to go off.

Is there something bugging you?

teehee!

chazbot
04-09-2007, 09:43 AM
Yeah, Liefeld's a less than spectacular storyteller who constantly fucks up characters' anatomy, but he's done plenty of good, stand alone covers, panels, and splash pages over the years. Give him credit when it's deserved and maybe I'll start to believe that some of the negativity I see comes from legitimate attempts to objectively critique his work. Right now, it all seems like the sort of mindless, fanboy sniping that most of the people on this board claim to dislike when it's aimed at more popular figures in the comic world.

you forgot to mention that when Liefeld is drawing, characters' costumes will change from page to page :D

kidding aside, you make some good points. I think fans just like to gang up on him because he has burned us. We've given him plenty of opportunities and dollars to try and wow us and has typically failed, more because of blown deadlines and rehashed ideas than because of individual talent.
Jim Lee has excelled on all fronts since the early Image days. Larsen and Jimmy V have dropped off the radar for most people but they have stuck to their guns and improved as storytellers and creators.
Liefeld has pretty much stayed stagnant...
at least imo, this is from where i think a lot of the "hate" stems.

Matt Jay
04-09-2007, 09:45 AM
Why should he? He knows it's going to sell well.
And that's the bottom line. I'm saying it's good that he sees that instead of dwelling on the vocal community of people who are less than pleased with his work. If we all had a large portion of the population screaming that we sucked, I bet most wouldn't handle it as well.

Thudpucker
02-12-2009, 01:52 PM
Did this ever come out?

Spidey616
02-12-2009, 02:04 PM
I assume it's still going to happen like Kirkman's Destroyer MAX mini which finally was solicited for April 2009

Dan-C
02-12-2009, 02:09 PM
Because this is the first time I've seen this thread I offer my first thought:

Holy shit! Feet!!

Greygor
02-12-2009, 02:15 PM
Any thread that refers to Liefeld you can just skip to the last page because you know what as been said in the previous 5, 10, 40, 60 pages.

Guys & Gals, get over it, you don't like him, don't buy his books :frustrat:

HALF-DEMON-INUYASHA
02-12-2009, 02:30 PM
Preview of my new project from Marvel Comics with superstar writer Robert Kirkman, coming in 2008


http://i15.tinypic.com/2d10n08.jpg
it that KILLRAVEN???
ARE YOU SURE THATS LEIFELD. THIS PIC ACTUALLY HAS BACKGROUND


***im texting through my phone I cant get every fucking word right

Punk Rock Kid
02-12-2009, 02:34 PM
it that KILLRAVEN???
ARE YOU SURE THATS LEIFELD. THIS PIC ACTUALLY HAS BACHGROUND

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v368/Poplinocktop/facepalm.jpg

atxbomber
02-12-2009, 02:36 PM
THIS PIC ACTUALLY HAS BACHGROUND

http://pro.corbis.com/images/DB002800.jpg?size=67&uid={4E179936-A341-4223-BD1D-DA7CB7DF5755}

Bachground?

Thudpucker
02-12-2009, 03:20 PM
http://pro.corbis.com/images/DB002800.jpg?size=67&uid={4E179936-A341-4223-BD1D-DA7CB7DF5755}

Bachground?


:lol: nice.

Whip
02-12-2009, 04:07 PM
This thread is fantastic.

/(. . )/
02-13-2009, 12:25 AM
it that KILLRAVEN???
ARE YOU SURE THATS LEIFELD. THIS PIC ACTUALLY HAS BACKGROUND


***im texting through my phone I cant get every fucking word right

you can tell it's Liefeld by the sword handle.

nick maynard
02-13-2009, 12:47 AM
Did this ever come out?

no. i assume they're waiting on liefeld to get the issues finished.

HALF-DEMON-INUYASHA
02-13-2009, 01:01 AM
you can tell it's Liefeld by the sword handle.
liefeld usually dosent have background. very sparse. devoid of depth.
brigade #1(background by someone else). cable 75( shadows below the chracters and giant cross streak). teen titans 27 - 28